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Post by OtishOtish on Sept 12, 2012 21:36:08 GMT 3
Perhaps in your many wanderings in the Orient, you visited a banana bar in the Philippines or Thailand? There is a specialisation, in which a generously proportioned banana is consumed, much more in the fashion in which a snake slowly devours jaw-breaking prey, but by other anatomical parts than the regular cavity. That seems a bit mild. In Patpong, a famous thing-area in Bangkok---an appropriate name in that context---everything imaginable is on offer. In fact, I have seen that thing blow a trumpet. I have been told that that thing can blow a trumpet. And that was is only one of many "miracles" on display. For the more exotic element and extras, I have been told that the real den of iniquity is Pattaya. There, funny wazungus get all their needs catered to---a midget, an amputee, a super-hairy, extra-thin, the most number in the shortest time... Imagination is the only limit. But it is important to put all these things into a serious context: One of the countries that has achieved an amazing transformation is Singapore. Lee Kwan Yew ran it with a tight fist for many years----in his words, developing countries need more discipline than democracy---and his book, From Third World To First, should be considered a must-read. (His son, who took over, is a much nicer who keeps the iron fist ina nice velvet glove.) In Singapore, laziness and infractions of the law (from jaywalking and improper disposal of chewing-gum to serious corruption) are dealt with swiftly and severely; so there is very, very little. But prostitution is legal. (Naturally it is regulated and monitored in the typical Singaporean way.) Lee has explained the reason for this, in person and in his book: he had thought about it, studied practices in different countries, and concluded that men being able to freely get some in+out enhances the general well-being of a country. The serious context here is all those energetic, angry, and unemployed young men in Kenya.
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Post by jakaswanga on Sept 12, 2012 22:39:26 GMT 3
Lee Kwan Yew ran it with a tight fist for many years----in his words, developing countries need more discipline than democracy---and his book, From Third World To First, should be considered a must-read. Yes, I think I said it once on this blog, but it is worth repeating. Lee K. Yew stated: The Africans in the room did not join the laughter! NB± Bangkok in Thailand= Patpong! hmmmm wuothi eka ine!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 13, 2012 19:29:20 GMT 3
Perhaps in your many wanderings in the Orient, you visited a banana bar in the Philippines or Thailand? There is a specialisation, in which a generously proportioned banana is consumed, much more in the fashion in which a snake slowly devours jaw-breaking prey, but by other anatomical parts than the regular cavity. That seems a bit mild. In Patpong, a famous thing-area in Bangkok---an appropriate name in that context---everything imaginable is on offer. In fact, I have seen that thing blow a trumpet. I have been told that that thing can blow a trumpet. And that was is only one of many "miracles" on display. For the more exotic element and extras, I have been told that the real den of iniquity is Pattaya. There, funny wazungus get all their needs catered to---a midget, an amputee, a super-hairy, extra-thin, the most number in the shortest time... Imagination is the only limit. But it is important to put all these things into a serious context: One of the countries that has achieved an amazing transformation is Singapore. Lee Kwan Yew ran it with a tight fist for many years----in his words, developing countries need more discipline than democracy---and his book, From Third World To First, should be considered a must-read. (His son, who took over, is a much nicer who keeps the iron fist ina nice velvet glove.) In Singapore, laziness and infractions of the law (from jaywalking and improper disposal of chewing-gum to serious corruption) are dealt with swiftly and severely; so there is very, very little. But prostitution is legal. (Naturally it is regulated and monitored in the typical Singaporean way.) Lee has explained the reason for this, in person and in his book: he had thought about it, studied practices in different countries, and concluded that men being able to freely get some in+out enhances the general well-being of a country. The serious context here is all those energetic, angry, and unemployed young men in Kenya. otishotish and jakaswangai found your exchange here where you've reduced women to pieces of meat for male consumption disgusting. I find it as offensive as if I'd read comments by some white supremacistt who described people of colour as subhuman really. Women in this world do not exist to satisfy your depraved notions of us and our bodies even when we've been forced to sell ourselves. Ever since the civil rights movement women have called progressive and even revolutionary men out on their misogyny. So what I'm saying to you is that we've been there and done that. We've seen your ilk over and over again in every liberation movement. Do you two have daughters? Do you have female relatives? Do you have mothers? Would it be funny or exciting for you if other men in the world thought and spoke of them in the terms you've done here? Or do you think they are exempt from the misogyny in the hearts of MEN. And make no mistake, I speak of MEN not as human beings but as people of that particular gender. As I've told you before jakaswanga, your clarity on many issues and the great contributions you make here @ jukwaa mean nothing to me if you can't get past your misogyny. I have ended otherwise wonderful friendships with white people over their use of the N word. Same bullshit to me!
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Post by jakaswanga on Sept 13, 2012 19:37:26 GMT 3
OTISHOTISH, you will soon see why I transferred this here. It is all China! Jakaswanga: What I had in mind was "aid", not FDI. FDI from Europe has generally been decreasing--e.g. in Kenya, from the UK. "Aid" on the other hand still counts for a great deal, e.g. the $0.5 billion per year that the USA gives Kenya for health. For Kenya, I estimate that the difference between what China lends us and what it gives us as "aid" (read grants) is a factor of about 15-20 in favour of loans. Otishotish, what is this fixation with aid? what kind of people want to develop with aid? aid is like you giving your kids peremende to keep them busy elsewhere, essentially a denigrating reflex. Aid is nothing but dependency complex, a father to his lost children. I take lessons from the reconstruction of Europe after the devastation of the second world War. A loan called the Marshall plan did the trick, to be repaid to the last cent! --good terms though, that is relatively non 'sharky' interest rates, and long run time. Some EU countries I think are still repaying. NB: Part of the terms was maintaining the American troops stationed in their countries to protect them from the then Red Menace of Moscow. The moment the menace ceased, they wanted the troops out to reduce the bill! And the "$20bn pledged in FOCAC 2012" is all for loans, which we will use to import Chinese products and labour. The real question has to be what we get out of Chinese loans that we would not get from loans from elsewhere. A lot of little men working 18-hr days for peanuts while their brethren take over everything, including making mandazis and hawking 2nd-hand clothes? No, this loan is earmarked for import substitution manufacturing chiefly. And yes, the heavy machinery will be imported from China. Why import a steel-plate shaper from Germany at x500 times the price? the quality price ratio, given Germany is no 1 industrial tools manufacturer, is still un-economical. Special thing about Chinese loans is their terms. You know like when you want mortgage from your bank, there is an array of choices. You pick the one best suited to your situation. So simple. 1. Angola wanted loans from the West. First they had to sell the oil at world market price in $, with its fluctuations, and then convert the $ to the currency of the loan if otherwise, before using the money to pay the interest and servicing. [You may be surprised at what happens in that process. China came in, said we agree at a price of oil/barrel in our currencies at our exchange rates. There is no currency trading. --This is the kind of thing which made sure Saddam Husein had to be overthrown: changing the currency of trading oil from the $. What's more most Chinese money is actually going to just a handful of countries, excluding Kenya---last time I checked almost 50% was going to just 4 countries. Guess which ones? Yep, the ones with the most natural resources to be exploited. No, no longer a handful of countries, that was the experimental phase. Check again. Some countries you never heard of, China is the biggest guy. Digging up minerals you never heard of! China is Africa's leading trade partner: you seriously think that would be in 4 countries? Kenya is a designated special economic zone, and that is quite something out of that pledged $20bn. [there is a trick here many people do no want to understand. Wen Jiabao said: the west has lent Africa money in the last 50 years and is crying all is lost. We have no intention of repeating that experience. If folks do not wake up to this statement, they will wake up to find ... refer to your story about ants and a large corpse!] So, the Chinese have agreed to lend all of Africa $20 billion over a certain period. How much will all of Africa be borrowing from elsewhere during that period? World Bank statistics and UNCTAD will be a good place to monitor. But a closer look at that statement --lend to Afrika reveals a caveat better studied in detail. As I said, China is crossing the wide deep river by feeling the stones under. Cautious, Careful. Prudent. Even if we were to assume that the $20 billion is all FDI, which it isn't, to my mind it is not an "unbeatable monster". In 2011, FDI transfers around the world totaled about $1.5 trillion. Take a look at where it went. In Africa only 3 or 4 countries got figures worth talking about. On the other hand, African countries spent quite a lot elsewhere (e.g. on Chinese junk), and don't forget the stuff from the ground. Chinese junk, aka consumer goods, have opened the lives of millions of Africans hitherto excluded from the world market. Cheap radios, videos, have changed cultural consumption in Africa. Naija movies have taken over Africa, coz even in the darkest village, a cheap Chinese generator can run a cheap Chinese video-CD recorder. And a cheap Chinese cellar-phone, $3, with a solar charger, $5, made sure mobile use in Africa in one decade registered a 4000% rise![this figure from the economist]. In the same period, companies like Siemens and Philips, axed their mobile phone divisions: no demand. Actually there was demand, huge demand for mobile phones, only at a less than what they considered worth their while. the dragon feasted! and feasted! FDI: yet in the past decade those small, insignificant FDIs from China, have been the fuel of growth! shows you how some real effort would really change things! Africa seems to be the place where you put in as little as possible but reap rewards out of proportion. By normal accounting, it should be a good place to invest, but I imagine it doesn't help when the natives indulge in mayhem over elections, over grazing land, etc. Even as a Kenyan who loves Kenya, I do not think it is a particularly good place to invest money in---all that corruption and stealing, from government officials to even ones own relatives! Yes, by the so called investment index, Africa ranked so low, FDI from the West dried up! Companies disengaged. This was when mags like the economist talked of Afrika as the lost continent. The Chinese disagreed. They saw a trillion worth of minerals under the bowels of the Congo. They saw Libya swimming in oil, Angola, Chad, Sudan, and Zambia as one large mine! Yes there was war --in the Congo, Angola, Chad etc, but Deng Hsiao Ping came from a party that had been at war for 50 years. The party understood wars, and economics, and had produced some of the toughest dealers in primitive death. Africa was no place to fear. And China is no place where 200 thousand dead Chinese in AFRICA in one year would be mourned. It would be more like good riddance! When the world woke up, they claimed China had colonised Africa. The wars-zone of primitive tribes, had been their opportunity to profit, and they had taken it. Those who dare, reap ---or die. It is also interesting that you should mention the diaspora remittances. For Kenya, we are now approaching $1 billion per year. And almost all of that is from Kenyans in the West. Perhaps we should be exporting Kenyans instead of borrowing from China and importing Chinese. On remittance, yes, the Philippines lived handsomely by exporting prostitutes, housemaids for massive abuse in the Arab world, cooks and sheep-slaves. I gather they did well out of it, at least the elite did. we will get there after all the natural resources are depleted. So patience. I once took a quick look at all the figures involved---aid, loans, diaspora remittances, whatever---and concluded that the Great Saviors from China may not quite be that. Of course, I have no problem if our new friends eventually push down the price of chickens, sukuma-wiki, and hookers. I heard of this word Savior before, Jesus and the rest. I find people who look for saviors a nuisance to themselves. Of China, I like to refer people to the scriptures of Chou en Lai, as retold by Deng Hsiao Ping and his disciples! A wake up call! As you can tell, I am not particularly enamoured of your new Chinese friends. We bent over while the West stuck it to us. Now we are bending over for East---actually just China, since the USSR already had its go---to do it to us. (The Chinese, though are more rapacious, and there's a bloody huge number of them.) After that, I guess it will be South America's turn. When do Africans wake up and start to seriously take care of Africa and Africans? That is the crux of the matter. Liberation. The deadliest word I know of. Took the Chinese themselves a century of civil war and strife. No easy options, no panacea. But it can not be postponed forever. A lot is said and written about what China is supposedly putting into Africa. How about we stop for a bit and consider what they are getting out of Africa. It is all in the open what they are getting out. Always put their cards on the table. If you want to ruin your countries, that is your own problem not ours, they said. We want this and that. If you want to kill half the other tribe, or all the others, be my guest. We plan to do the same with Tibetans! have you not heard what Hu Jintao told Salva Kiir? about oil and North Sudan? (If you all killed yourselves and left the oil flowing, I would be satisfied. My problem is the war stopping the oil flowing]. That is why I love the Chinese. Ruthless clarity. The illusions will be yours to manufacture in your own head. I understood what you meant by "demise". My point is that those guys and the system they operate in won't be "demising" any time soon as long as the money to be eaten comes from the usual sources. Even the system has to demise. Look at Kenya now. Is it not a lawless state. Who takes the courts seriously? Moi son? Kabogo on Mercy Keino? teachers on strike? policemen themselves? Mombasa republicans? That is the anarchy of a dying order. This system can no longer mediate our conflicts. It is the army and death squads. That means power is no longer centralised. NB: I doubt anybody is enamoured with my new friends. They wreak fear and instinctive premonition wherever they operate. They are your modern plague! They have reduced once great american manufacturing regions to rotting wastelands, have europe by the balls, and are disembowelling Africa! My new friends, are a game changer. Even in the meat business!
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Post by jakaswanga on Sept 13, 2012 19:37:47 GMT 3
OTISHOTISH, you will soon see why I transferred this here. It is all China! Jakaswanga: What I had in mind was "aid", not FDI. FDI from Europe has generally been decreasing--e.g. in Kenya, from the UK. "Aid" on the other hand still counts for a great deal, e.g. the $0.5 billion per year that the USA gives Kenya for health. For Kenya, I estimate that the difference between what China lends us and what it gives us as "aid" (read grants) is a factor of about 15-20 in favour of loans. Otishotish, what is this fixation with aid? what kind of people want to develop with aid? aid is like you giving your kids peremende to keep them busy elsewhere, essentially a denigrating reflex. Aid is nothing but dependency complex, a father to his lost children. I take lessons from the reconstruction of Europe after the devastation of the second world War. A loan called the Marshall plan did the trick, to be repaid to the last cent! --good terms though, that is relatively non 'sharky' interest rates, and long run time. Some EU countries I think are still repaying. NB: Part of the terms was maintaining the American troops stationed in their countries to protect them from the then Red Menace of Moscow. The moment the menace ceased, they wanted the troops out to reduce the bill! And the "$20bn pledged in FOCAC 2012" is all for loans, which we will use to import Chinese products and labour. The real question has to be what we get out of Chinese loans that we would not get from loans from elsewhere. A lot of little men working 18-hr days for peanuts while their brethren take over everything, including making mandazis and hawking 2nd-hand clothes? No, this loan is earmarked for import substitution manufacturing chiefly. And yes, the heavy machinery will be imported from China. Why import a steel-plate shaper from Germany at x500 times the price? the quality price ratio, given Germany is no 1 industrial tools manufacturer, is still un-economical. Special thing about Chinese loans is their terms. You know like when you want mortgage from your bank, there is an array of choices. You pick the one best suited to your situation. So simple. 1. Angola wanted loans from the West. First they had to sell the oil at world market price in $, with its fluctuations, and then convert the $ to the currency of the loan if otherwise, before using the money to pay the interest and servicing. [You may be surprised at what happens in that process. China came in, said we agree at a price of oil/barrel in our currencies at our exchange rates. There is no currency trading. --This is the kind of thing which made sure Saddam Husein had to be overthrown: changing the currency of trading oil from the $. What's more most Chinese money is actually going to just a handful of countries, excluding Kenya---last time I checked almost 50% was going to just 4 countries. Guess which ones? Yep, the ones with the most natural resources to be exploited. No, no longer a handful of countries, that was the experimental phase. Check again. Some countries you never heard of, China is the biggest guy. Digging up minerals you never heard of! China is Africa's leading trade partner: you seriously think that would be in 4 countries? Kenya is a designated special economic zone, and that is quite something out of that pledged $20bn. [there is a trick here many people do no want to understand. Wen Jiabao said: the west has lent Africa money in the last 50 years and is crying all is lost. We have no intention of repeating that experience. If folks do not wake up to this statement, they will wake up to find ... refer to your story about ants and a large corpse!] So, the Chinese have agreed to lend all of Africa $20 billion over a certain period. How much will all of Africa be borrowing from elsewhere during that period? World Bank statistics and UNCTAD will be a good place to monitor. But a closer look at that statement --lend to Afrika reveals a caveat better studied in detail. As I said, China is crossing the wide deep river by feeling the stones under. Cautious, Careful. Prudent. Even if we were to assume that the $20 billion is all FDI, which it isn't, to my mind it is not an "unbeatable monster". In 2011, FDI transfers around the world totaled about $1.5 trillion. Take a look at where it went. In Africa only 3 or 4 countries got figures worth talking about. On the other hand, African countries spent quite a lot elsewhere (e.g. on Chinese junk), and don't forget the stuff from the ground. Chinese junk, aka consumer goods, have opened the lives of millions of Africans hitherto excluded from the world market. Cheap radios, videos, have changed cultural consumption in Africa. Naija movies have taken over Africa, coz even in the darkest village, a cheap Chinese generator can run a cheap Chinese video-CD recorder. And a cheap Chinese cellar-phone, $3, with a solar charger, $5, made sure mobile use in Africa in one decade registered a 4000% rise![this figure from the economist]. In the same period, companies like Siemens and Philips, axed their mobile phone divisions: no demand. Actually there was demand, huge demand for mobile phones, only at a less than what they considered worth their while. the dragon feasted! and feasted! FDI: yet in the past decade those small, insignificant FDIs from China, have been the fuel of growth! shows you how some real effort would really change things! Africa seems to be the place where you put in as little as possible but reap rewards out of proportion. By normal accounting, it should be a good place to invest, but I imagine it doesn't help when the natives indulge in mayhem over elections, over grazing land, etc. Even as a Kenyan who loves Kenya, I do not think it is a particularly good place to invest money in---all that corruption and stealing, from government officials to even ones own relatives! Yes, by the so called investment index, Africa ranked so low, FDI from the West dried up! Companies disengaged. This was when mags like the economist talked of Afrika as the lost continent. The Chinese disagreed. They saw a trillion worth of minerals under the bowels of the Congo. They saw Libya swimming in oil, Angola, Chad, Sudan, and Zambia as one large mine! Yes there was war --in the Congo, Angola, Chad etc, but Deng Hsiao Ping came from a party that had been at war for 50 years. The party understood wars, and economics, and had produced some of the toughest dealers in primitive death. Africa was no place to fear. And China is no place where 200 thousand dead Chinese in AFRICA in one year would be mourned. It would be more like good riddance! When the world woke up, they claimed China had colonised Africa. The wars-zone of primitive tribes, had been their opportunity to profit, and they had taken it. Those who dare, reap ---or die. It is also interesting that you should mention the diaspora remittances. For Kenya, we are now approaching $1 billion per year. And almost all of that is from Kenyans in the West. Perhaps we should be exporting Kenyans instead of borrowing from China and importing Chinese. On remittance, yes, the Philippines lived handsomely by exporting prostitutes, housemaids for massive abuse in the Arab world, cooks and sheep-slaves. I gather they did well out of it, at least the elite did. we will get there after all the natural resources are depleted. So patience. I once took a quick look at all the figures involved---aid, loans, diaspora remittances, whatever---and concluded that the Great Saviors from China may not quite be that. Of course, I have no problem if our new friends eventually push down the price of chickens, sukuma-wiki, and hookers. I heard of this word Savior before, Jesus and the rest. I find people who look for saviors a nuisance to themselves. Of China, I like to refer people to the scriptures of Chou en Lai, as retold by Deng Hsiao Ping and his disciples! A wake up call! As you can tell, I am not particularly enamoured of your new Chinese friends. We bent over while the West stuck it to us. Now we are bending over for East---actually just China, since the USSR already had its go---to do it to us. (The Chinese, though are more rapacious, and there's a bloody huge number of them.) After that, I guess it will be South America's turn. When do Africans wake up and start to seriously take care of Africa and Africans? That is the crux of the matter. Liberation. The deadliest word I know of. Took the Chinese themselves a century of civil war and strife. No easy options, no panacea. But it can not be postponed forever. A lot is said and written about what China is supposedly putting into Africa. How about we stop for a bit and consider what they are getting out of Africa. It is all in the open what they are getting out. Always put their cards on the table. If you want to ruin your countries, that is your own problem not ours, they said. We want this and that. If you want to kill half the other tribe, or all the others, be my guest. We plan to do the same with Tibetans! have you not heard what Hu Jintao told Salva Kiir? about oil and North Sudan? (If you all killed yourselves and left the oil flowing, I would be satisfied. My problem is the war stopping the oil flowing]. That is why I love the Chinese. Ruthless clarity. The illusions will be yours to manufacture in your own head. I understood what you meant by "demise". My point is that those guys and the system they operate in won't be "demising" any time soon as long as the money to be eaten comes from the usual sources. Even the system has to demise. Look at Kenya now. Is it not a lawless state. Who takes the courts seriously? Moi son? Kabogo on Mercy Keino? teachers on strike? policemen themselves? Mombasa republicans? That is the anarchy of a dying order. This system can no longer mediate our conflicts. It is the army and death squads. That means power is no longer centralised. NB: I doubt anybody is enamoured with my new friends. They wreak fear and instinctive premonition wherever they operate. They are your modern plague! They have reduced once great american manufacturing regions to rotting wastelands, have europe by the balls, and are disembowelling Africa! My new friends, are a game changer. Even in the meat business!
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Post by OtishOtish on Sept 13, 2012 20:43:45 GMT 3
[quote author=jakaswanga board=general thread=7208 post=107060 time=1347554267 Otishotish, what is this fixation with aid? what kind of people want to develop with aid? aid is like you giving your kids peremende to keep them busy elsewhere, essentially a denigrating reflex. Aid is nothing but dependency complex, a father to his lost children. [/quote] Not a fixation. Just trying to point out that China lending us money is not the same as China giving us money. On loans, the world's biggest creditor is also Kenya's biggest creditor; that is Japan. I don't buy that argument. "Smoothing" fluctuations is what Futures markets are all about. In fact, by agreeing to certain prices over some years, the parties are simply engaged in "off-market" futures trading, and it remains to be seen who the eventual winner is. It has nothing to do with what I think. I simply report what the numbers say. I always make an effort to do my homework before I make noise, but again. While there are all sorts of countries doing business with China, my statement was that both inflows and outflows are limited to just a handful. Looking at various sources, at figures for 2006-2011, just 4 countries accounted for 65% to 72% of Africa's exports to China. Here is a nice, easy read, complete with "density" maps. (It is a couple of years old, but there has been little relative change.) www.sv.uio.no/iss/personer/vit/heidiha/Haugen%202011%20(Chinese%20exports%20to%20Africa).pdfAnd on the nature of trade one has to consider which way the money is flowing. Did you know that more of our (Kenya) exports go to each of Afghanistan and Pakistan than to China? On the other hand, China ranks third among the countries we import from. Here is Zuma issuing a wake-up call: www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/33686fc4-d171-11e1-bbbc-00144feabdc0.html#axzz26MzxcNOH I find astonishing both the claim of Chinese FDI fuelling African growth and the claim of Western FDI drying up. Having looked at numerous figures, from numerous sources: First, the OECD countries have in the last decade and until now accounted for over 70% of FDI into Africa. Second, Chinese FDI into Africa in the same period has been around 1% of FDI into Africa. (The figures are a bit better if one looks at just sub-Saharan Africa but not enough for one to say, yep it's all China.) Are we to believe that the Chinese 1% is doing more or is worth more notice than the other 99%? By the way, China now appears to be Kenya's largest source of FDI. But what proportion of all FDI into Kenya does it contribute? It is true that the Chinese are doing more than ever in Africa. But it appears to be far more than it actually is, mainly because we have a lot of little men running around, building large infrastructure that excites the public while enjoying Njeris and ruining indigenous small traders. P.S. And now the Turks too are joining in the "gold rush": blogs.ft.com/beyond-brics/2012/06/28/turkey-inc-looks-to-challenge-china-in-africa/#axzz26NNVBPWbIndians, Turks, Chinese, whatever. Are Africans incapable of manual labour?
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Post by jakaswanga on Sept 14, 2012 18:49:55 GMT 3
First, the OECD countries have in the last decade and until now accounted for over 70% of FDI into Africa.Second, Chinese FDI into Africa in the same period has been around 1% of FDI into Africa. (The figures are a bit better if one looks at just sub-Saharan Africa but not enough for one to say, yep it's all China.) Are we to believe that the Chinese 1% is doing more or is worth more notice than the other 99%? By the way, China now appears to be Kenya's largest source of FDI. But what proportion of all FDI into Kenya does it contribute? otishotishOECD in toto! That is the whole world economy bar the BRICS! --You do not want to compare China with say the EU, or the USA only? HERE ARE THE OECD COUNTRIES. THE OFFICIAL NUMBER SHOULD TOTAL 34! BUT CHECK WHO THEY ARE ON THE LIST OF WORLD DOMINANT ECONOMIES! THE dominants OF THE WORLD! [wikipedia] 1960. Since then fourteen countries have become members of the Organisation.
Here is a list of the Member countries of the Organisation and the dates on which they deposited their instruments of ratification. Click on the name of the country to consult OECD work on that particular country.Country / Date AUSTRALIA 7 June 1971 AUSTRIA 29 September 1961 BELGIUM 13 September 1961 CANADA 10 April 1961 CHILE 7 May 2010 CZECH REPUBLIC 21 December 1995 DENMARK 30 May 196 Estonia 9 December 2010 FINLAND 28 January 1969 FRANCE 7 August 1961 GERMANY 27 September 1961 GREECE 27 September 1961 HUNGARY 7 May 1996 ICELAND 5 June 1961 IRELAND 17 August 1961 Israel 7 September 2010 ITALY 29 March 1962 JAPAN 28 April 1964 KOREA 12 December 1996 LUXEMBOURG 7 December 1961 MEXICO 18 May 1994 NETHERLANDS 13 November 1961 NEW ZEALAND 29 May 1973 NORWAY 4 July 1961 POLAND 22 November 1996 PORTUGAL 4 August 1961 SLOVAK REPUBLIC 14 December 2000 SLOVENIA 21 July 2010 SPAIN 3 August 1961 SWEDEN 28 September 1961 SWITZERLAND 28 September 1961 TURKEY 2 August 1961 UNITED KINGDOM 2 May 1961 UNITED STATES 12 April 1961 ----------------------- Now me thinks if the OECD is serious about investing in your continent, you will go places. That their investment regime produced a tattered Africa, is the new opportunity. North America plus the EU-states with the satelites that orbit around her to the East. Add Japan and Mexico! That is is just about the ALL THE KIDS OF THE BLOCK, of the whole world economy. The block one the BRICS are challenging. NB: 1. There are those who include the infrastructural programmes of China in Afrika under FDI, because they are funded by their own money. 2. There are those who exclude them. The disparity in figures reached by either model is astonishing. As to whether Africans can do manual work? I have to think about that one. Do you remember the regime of the 'AKIDAS'?
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Post by jakaswanga on Sept 14, 2012 18:54:47 GMT 3
Kathure-K. Did I reduce women to pieces of meat, or am i describing an existent reality? you can try sexing up raw, brutal reality with politically correct terms. I will avoid such terms, like sex-worker, for they only muddy the clarity of my report.
When I write the meat market, I am sure I portray the reality of forced prostitution with honest brutality. Animals in an abbatoir. Forced to supply meat. Will be thrown as litter when meat is rotten and no one buys. Now you tell me your term for it.
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Post by OtishOtish on Sept 14, 2012 19:28:58 GMT 3
otishotish and jakaswanga I found your exchange here where you've reduced women to pieces of meat for male consumption disgusting. I find it as offensive as if I'd read comments by some white supremacistt who described people of colour as subhuman really. Women in this world do not exist to satisfy your depraved notions of us and our bodies even when we've been forced to sell ourselves. Kathure: Wow, wow, wow. Easy there, dada. Wrong target. The people you want to deal with are in Thailand; I simpy reported what I have seen been told. It is unfortunate, wrong and immoral for women to be forced to sell their bodies, whether by circumstance or by other people. But if women who have other options available choose to do so, then I have few problems with it. To that extent, I support legalized prostitution; in fact, I think more of it would solve a great number of problems. No, obviously women do not exist to satisfy "depraved notions"---mine or of other men. Nevertheless, l (and many men) have found it helpful that there exist women who are ready and willing to do the needful. In fact, a few of the women I have dealt with were way more depraved than I am but in ways that I rather liked. A little story: Many years ago, when I was a young, single man, I briefly had a "silent" agreement with a young lady, whom I called my "girlfriend". She would come over at the end of the week and give me a little ding-dong. In the morning, she would ask for "taxi fare" home; it was understood that I would provide enough to take 10 limos. At the end of the month, when the rent and other bills were due, it was understood that the "taxi fare" would approach something like the cost of hiring a small plane for an hour. Etc. At all other times, she never bothered me, and, as I was a bit of a workaholic then, I never bothered her; we both liked the arrangement. She was a very nice lady---educated office-worker from a respectable family. And delightfully depraved. I don't consider that I have ever been in any "liberation movement". What's more, I don't have the slightest interest in "liberating" anybody: as I see it, people can never truly be liberated by others; they can only liberate themselves. Besides, since when did an interest in "liberation" kill an interest in ding-dong. Hmmm. Class, today we will learn the meaning of the word "misandry". The word originates from the Greek ... There is a serious discussion that could be had here, but we can't have it as long as you are being unnecessarilu and excessively emotional. By the way, regarding battles for your sistren, there is one I suggested (and which you nicely dodged): when are Kenyan women really and properly going to tackle the matter of female genital mutilation in places like Kenya?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2012 23:30:28 GMT 3
Kathure-K. Did I reduce women to pieces of meat, or am i describing an existent reality? you can try sexing up raw, brutal reality with politically correct terms. I will avoid such terms, like sex-worker, for they only muddy the clarity of my report. When I write the meat market, I am sure I portray the reality of forced prostitution with honest brutality. Animals in an abbatoir. Forced to supply meat. Will be thrown as litter when meat is rotten and no one buys. Now you tell me your term for it. jakaswangahow dare i call you out on your bull shit? Thanks for the insults up to and including the dating site. gottcha!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2012 23:40:01 GMT 3
otishotish and jakaswanga I found your exchange here where you've reduced women to pieces of meat for male consumption disgusting. I find it as offensive as if I'd read comments by some white supremacistt who described people of colour as subhuman really. Women in this world do not exist to satisfy your depraved notions of us and our bodies even when we've been forced to sell ourselves. Kathure: Wow, wow, wow. Easy there, dada. Wrong target. The people you want to deal with are in Thailand; I simpy reported what I have seen been told. It is unfortunate, wrong and immoral for women to be forced to sell their bodies, whether by circumstance or by other people. But if women who have other options available choose to do so, then I have few problems with it. To that extent, I support legalized prostitution; in fact, I think more of it would solve a great number of problems. No, obviously women do not exist to satisfy "depraved notions"---mine or of other men. Nevertheless, l (and many men) have found it helpful that there exist women who are ready and willing to do the needful. In fact, a few of the women I have dealt with were way more depraved than I am but in ways that I rather liked. A little story: Many years ago, when I was a young, single man, I briefly had a "silent" agreement with a young lady, whom I called my "girlfriend". She would come over at the end of the week and give me a little ding-dong. In the morning, she would ask for "taxi fare" home; it was understood that I would provide enough to take 10 limos. At the end of the month, when the rent and other bills were due, it was understood that the "taxi fare" would approach something like the cost of hiring a small plane for an hour. Etc. At all other times, she never bothered me, and, as I was a bit of a workaholic then, I never bothered her; we both liked the arrangement. She was a very nice lady---educated office-worker from a respectable family. And delightfully depraved. I don't consider that I have ever been in any "liberation movement". What's more, I don't have the slightest interest in "liberating" anybody: as I see it, people can never truly be liberated by others; they can only liberate themselves. Besides, since when did an interest in "liberation" kill an interest in ding-dong. Hmmm. Class, today we will learn the meaning of the word "misandry". The word originates from the Greek ... There is a serious discussion that could be had here, but we can't have it as long as you are being unnecessarilu and excessively emotional. By the way, regarding battles for your sistren, there is one I suggested (and which you nicely dodged): when are Kenyan women really and properly going to tackle the matter of female genital mutilation in places like Kenya? otishotishyou too! how dare i challenge the two of you? please accept my apologies for that! won't try that any time soon. see RR got to tell me that I'm as old as his mother and therefore have no business having a sexual life and such. and dear me I didn't even respond to that. And you and jakaswanga will not hear anyone else here including the women challenge what you've said because they too hate my guts. it's all good.
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Post by OtishOtish on Sept 15, 2012 0:22:25 GMT 3
otishotishyou too! how dare i challenge the two of you? please accept my apologies for that! won't try that any time soon. see RR got to tell me that I'm as old as his mother and therefore have no business having a sexual life and such. and dear me I didn't even respond to that. And you and jakaswanga will not hear anyone else here including the women challenge what you've said because they too hate my guts. it's all good. Kathure: We can always learn when we get challenged on what we say, or write, or believe in. But does that mean that the "challenged" is obliged to shut up when "challenged" and especially when misunderstood in such a "challenge"? As my responses show, I have heard you, and I am hearing you. Which reminds me of this CD I got for Christmas: www.last.fm/music/Branford+Marsalis/I+Heard+You+Twice+the+First+TimeAnyway, see my last paragraph above. RR was wrong: People can and do get it off at any age, and indeed they should. Why, just a few weeks ago my wife and I took her parents to look at a very nice retirement home---nice apartment, servants all over the place, etc. They liked it but after talking to some of the natives decided it's a den of sin, and even to my eye they did look a bit to happy for people on the way out. Anyway ... apparently, the place is full of above-80 widows and widowers who, thanks to Big Pharma, are, as they enter the autumn of life, making the most of the last summer-sun. Good for them, I say. Come as you go. So, regardless of what RR thinks of your age, and whatever your age might be, listen to this lady: And cut back on the misandry.
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Post by abdulmote on Sept 15, 2012 0:29:12 GMT 3
Kathure,
I can understand you pain.
Some lessons of life are difficult to be learnt and one of them is empathy. That simple understanding and appreciation of what someone else may feel, yet without experiencing the same. Sadly in this modern world, we seem more ignorant despite knowledge being in abundance. Today we are more divided as humans, despite being creatures of the same race.
Gender, religion, race, tribe, sexuality and what have you, are the differences that make us who we are. Yet we are so mentally segregated, that we can only empathise with whom we may identify ourselves with and not the other, who may also be one of us. We are sadly a species divided.
Having said that, whilst fair criticisms against another should be encouraged, we must also at the same time do that with sensitivity in mind and sufficient awareness in our practice. In doing that we must not infer blanket condemnation upon our own mothers, sisters, brothers, friends and neighbours, simply because they are not one of us.
End of the day, freedom of expression should be encouraged to exist, but with its limitation which deny inciters the opportunities to propagate either hatred, fear, mischief, violence or even mockery of our families in common.
We have to strive to live in peace and respect for one another that we may exist in our live in harmony that we all desire and want.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2012 0:41:49 GMT 3
Kathure, I can understand you pain. Some lessons of life are difficult to be learnt and one of them is empathy. That simple understanding and appreciation of what someone else may feel, yet without experiencing the same. Sadly in this modern world, we seem more ignorant despite knowledge being in abundance. Today we are more divided as humans, despite being creatures of the same race. Gender, religion, race, tribe, sexuality and what have you, are the differences that make us who we are. Yet we are so mentally segregated, that we can only empathise with whom we may identify ourselves with and not the other, who may also be one of us. We are sadly a species divided. Having said that, whilst fair criticisms against another should be encouraged, we must also at the same time do that with sensitivity in mind and sufficient awareness in our practice. In doing that we must not infer blanket condemnation upon our own mothers, sisters, brothers, friends and neighbours, simply because they are not one of us. End of the day, freedom of expression should be encouraged to exist, but with its limitation which deny inciters the opportunities to propagate either hatred, fear, mischief, violence or even mockery of our families in common. We have to strive to live in peace and respect for one another that we may exist in our live in harmony that we all desire and want. abdulthis is what i get when i click on the links you gave within the body of your comments. what am i supposed to do with that? jakaswanga and otishotish had much fun talking about women as though we are pieces of meat. sadik got kicked out of here because he'd made disgusting comments about Luo women. I stood up against that in my capacity as a human being and as moderator here though the insults weren't directed at me. I understand though that an injury to one is an injury to all. But jakaswanga has been and can get away with murder here. that's how i take it.
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Post by abdulmote on Sept 15, 2012 0:50:57 GMT 3
Kathure,
I am with you. I think you may have misread my 'general comments' which were targeted at the two gents mentioned and everybody else. And there were no external "links" provided.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2012 0:51:28 GMT 3
otishotishyou too! how dare i challenge the two of you? please accept my apologies for that! won't try that any time soon. see RR got to tell me that I'm as old as his mother and therefore have no business having a sexual life and such. and dear me I didn't even respond to that. And you and jakaswanga will not hear anyone else here including the women challenge what you've said because they too hate my guts. it's all good. Kathure: We can always learn when we get challenged on what we say, or write, or believe in. But does that mean that the "challenged" is obliged to shut up when "challenged" and especially when misunderstood in such a "challenge"? As my responses show, I have heard you, and I am hearing you. Which reminds me of this CD I got for Christmas: www.last.fm/music/Branford+Marsalis/I+Heard+You+Twice+the+First+TimeAnyway, see my last paragraph above. RR was wrong: People can and do get it off at any age, and indeed they should. Why, just a few weeks ago my wife and I took her parents to look at a very nice retirement home---nice apartment, servants all over the place, etc. They liked it but after talking to some of the natives decided it's a den of sin, and even to my eye they did look a bit to happy for people on the way out. Anyway ... apparently, the place is full of above-80 widows and widowers who, thanks to Big Pharma, are, as they enter the autumn of life, making the most of the last summer-sun. Good for them, I say. Come as you go. So, regardless of what RR thinks of your age, and whatever your age might be, listen to this lady: And cut back on the misandry. Ah, otishotish, the 'exotic taste'! The following story is from Angola, but it could be duplicated anywhere across the continent. You will remember recently, the link should already be in this thread, how a few hundred Chinese hard-boiled criminals were arrested and deported from that country, in a joint transcontinental operation involving the Angolans, the Macao, HongKong and mainland Chinese police. One of the regions they majored in was EXOTIC MEAT SUPPLY.A careful study of the African meat market in the respective country, revealed a hole in the market, as far as the practice of a certain specialisation is concerned. Perhaps in your many wanderings in the Orient, you visited a banana bar in the Philippines or Thailand? There is a specialisation, in which a generously proportioned banana is consumed, much more in the fashion in which a snake slowly devours jaw-breaking prey, but by other anatomical parts than the regular cavity.It became a run-away hit in Angola. And this Angola, even before we qualify her statistics as shady and oily, is currently Africa's fastest growing economy. So a lot of guys there can afford to indulge in exotic tastes. And the ever enterprising Chinese read the situation correct, and organised the biggest sino-african prostitution ring. Lets say it could be the now not so much in demand local meat that used to cater for the oil pumped-up nouveau riche of Angola, that put a spanner in the works to recapture the lost market! I surmise there is a brothel in Nairobi and her environs offering African, Indian, European and Asian meat for the Chinese construction workers around town. It can be a very busy session occasionally as a Njeri once told me. Only by body ordour do they count/record how many Chinese they have done in the hour. They haven't yet learnt how to differentiate Mr. Tao from Mr. Ping. Or Mao from Deng! All the same dik! --head. Read more: jukwaa.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=general&thread=7208&page=4#106917#ixzz26U0xxuWi
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Post by OtishOtish on Sept 15, 2012 1:00:22 GMT 3
Kathure:
I am not into "meat markets" at all. Do I wish prostitution did not exist anywhere in the world. Most definitely. Will that ever happen? Most definitely not. So, what should we do in this real world of realities? I think it should be regulated, monitored for exploitation, taxed, etc. The transactions should be of a sort that both parties enter into willingly, with reasonable expectations and acquisition of just rewards, under the full protection of the law, etc. With all that, we can avoid the sort of unhappy situation that Jakaswanga predicts and which I suspect will inevitably happen.
But you still haven't told me what you think of FGM. I'm keen to "hear" your views.
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Post by OtishOtish on Sept 15, 2012 1:02:48 GMT 3
Kathure: We can always learn when we get challenged on what we say, or write, or believe in. But does that mean that the "challenged" is obliged to shut up when "challenged" and especially when misunderstood in such a "challenge"? As my responses show, I have heard you, and I am hearing you. Which reminds me of this CD I got for Christmas: www.last.fm/music/Branford+Marsalis/I+Heard+You+Twice+the+First+TimeAnyway, see my last paragraph above. RR was wrong: People can and do get it off at any age, and indeed they should. Why, just a few weeks ago my wife and I took her parents to look at a very nice retirement home---nice apartment, servants all over the place, etc. They liked it but after talking to some of the natives decided it's a den of sin, and even to my eye they did look a bit to happy for people on the way out. Anyway ... apparently, the place is full of above-80 widows and widowers who, thanks to Big Pharma, are, as they enter the autumn of life, making the most of the last summer-sun. Good for them, I say. Come as you go. So, regardless of what RR thinks of your age, and whatever your age might be, listen to this lady: And cut back on the misandry. Ah, otishotish, the 'exotic taste'! The following story is from Angola, but it could be duplicated anywhere across the continent. You will remember recently, the link should already be in this thread, how a few hundred Chinese hard-boiled criminals were arrested and deported from that country, in a joint transcontinental operation involving the Angolans, the Macao, HongKong and mainland Chinese police. One of the regions they majored in was EXOTIC MEAT SUPPLY.A careful study of the African meat market in the respective country, revealed a hole in the market, as far as the practice of a certain specialisation is concerned. Perhaps in your many wanderings in the Orient, you visited a banana bar in the Philippines or Thailand? There is a specialisation, in which a generously proportioned banana is consumed, much more in the fashion in which a snake slowly devours jaw-breaking prey, but by other anatomical parts than the regular cavity.It became a run-away hit in Angola. And this Angola, even before we qualify her statistics as shady and oily, is currently Africa's fastest growing economy. So a lot of guys there can afford to indulge in exotic tastes. And the ever enterprising Chinese read the situation correct, and organised the biggest sino-african prostitution ring. Lets say it could be the now not so much in demand local meat that used to cater for the oil pumped-up nouveau riche of Angola, that put a spanner in the works to recapture the lost market! I surmise there is a brothel in Nairobi and her environs offering African, Indian, European and Asian meat for the Chinese construction workers around town. It can be a very busy session occasionally as a Njeri once told me. Only by body ordour do they count/record how many Chinese they have done in the hour. They haven't yet learnt how to differentiate Mr. Tao from Mr. Ping. Or Mao from Deng! All the same dik! --head. Read more: jukwaa.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=general&thread=7208&page=4#106917#ixzz26U0xxuWiBe careful with your quotes. OO never wrote anything of the sort.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2012 1:12:27 GMT 3
Perhaps in your many wanderings in the Orient, you visited a banana bar in the Philippines or Thailand? There is a specialisation, in which a generously proportioned banana is consumed, much more in the fashion in which a snake slowly devours jaw-breaking prey, but by other anatomical parts than the regular cavity. otishotishi've highlighted in red again your comments. From what you and jakaswanga can see I have no basis of challenging you guys? That seems a bit mild. In Patpong, a famous thing-area in Bangkok---an appropriate name in that context--- everything imaginable is on offer. In fact, I have seen that thing blow a trumpet. I have been told that that thing can blow a trumpet. And that was is only one of many "miracles" on display. For the more exotic element and extras, I have been told that the real den of iniquity is Pattaya. There, funny wazungus get all their needs catered to--- a midget, an amputee, a super-hairy, extra-thin, the most number in the shortest time... Imagination is the only limit. But it is important to put all these things into a serious context: One of the countries that has achieved an amazing transformation is Singapore. Lee Kwan Yew ran it with a tight fist for many years----in his words, developing countries need more discipline than democracy---and his book, From Third World To First, should be considered a must-read. (His son, who took over, is a much nicer who keeps the iron fist ina nice velvet glove.) In Singapore, laziness and infractions of the law (from jaywalking and improper disposal of chewing-gum to serious corruption) are dealt with swiftly and severely; so there is very, very little. But prostitution is legal. (Naturally it is regulated and monitored in the typical Singaporean way.) Lee has explained the reason for this, in person and in his book: he had thought about it, studied practices in different countries, and concluded that men being able to freely get some in+out enhances the general well-being of a country. The serious context here is all those energetic, angry, and unemployed young men in Kenya.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2012 1:15:46 GMT 3
Ah, otishotish, the 'exotic taste'! The following story is from Angola, but it could be duplicated anywhere across the continent. You will remember recently, the link should already be in this thread, how a few hundred Chinese hard-boiled criminals were arrested and deported from that country, in a joint transcontinental operation involving the Angolans, the Macao, HongKong and mainland Chinese police. One of the regions they majored in was EXOTIC MEAT SUPPLY.A careful study of the African meat market in the respective country, revealed a hole in the market, as far as the practice of a certain specialisation is concerned. Perhaps in your many wanderings in the Orient, you visited a banana bar in the Philippines or Thailand? There is a specialisation, in which a generously proportioned banana is consumed, much more in the fashion in which a snake slowly devours jaw-breaking prey, but by other anatomical parts than the regular cavity.It became a run-away hit in Angola. And this Angola, even before we qualify her statistics as shady and oily, is currently Africa's fastest growing economy. So a lot of guys there can afford to indulge in exotic tastes. And the ever enterprising Chinese read the situation correct, and organised the biggest sino-african prostitution ring. Lets say it could be the now not so much in demand local meat that used to cater for the oil pumped-up nouveau riche of Angola, that put a spanner in the works to recapture the lost market! I surmise there is a brothel in Nairobi and her environs offering African, Indian, European and Asian meat for the Chinese construction workers around town. It can be a very busy session occasionally as a Njeri once told me. Only by body ordour do they count/record how many Chinese they have done in the hour. They haven't yet learnt how to differentiate Mr. Tao from Mr. Ping. Or Mao from Deng! All the same dik! --head. Read more: jukwaa.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=general&thread=7208&page=4#106917#ixzz26U0xxuWiBe careful with your quotes. OO never wrote anything of the sort. obviously that's what jakaswanga said and there's a link below to show that. but you delighted in his comments and off you went with your demonstration of how low you view women.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2012 1:20:15 GMT 3
Kathure: I am not into "meat markets" at all. Do I wish prostitution did not exist anywhere in the world. Most definitely. Will that ever happen? Most definitely not. So, what should we do in this real world of realities? I think it should be regulated, monitored for exploitation, taxed, etc. The transactions should be of a sort that both parties enter into willingly, with reasonable expectations and acquisition of just rewards, under the full protection of the law, etc. With all that, we can avoid the sort of unhappy situation that Jakaswanga predicts and which I suspect will inevitably happen. But you still haven't told me what you think of FGM. I'm keen to "hear" your views. otishotishyour asking me about fgm because i'm a meru or what? everybody here knows what my position on that is and i've actually aquired enemies here @ jukwaa fighting folks over their justification of the same. so just be quiet! we aren't talking about whether prostitution should be legalized or not. we've had a thread about the mayor of nairobi trying to legalize prostitution because after all as you've said men can simply not do without degrading women. so they need prostitutes to feel man enough. we are talking about what you and jakaswanga said here on this thread about women who are forced into prostitution.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2012 1:23:22 GMT 3
Kathure, I am with you. I think you may have misread my 'general comments' which were targeted at the two gents mentioned and everybody else. And there were no external "links" provided. abdulthank you. my mistake and as such i've modified my post above removing what i mistakenly thought was the link.
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Post by OtishOtish on Sept 15, 2012 1:46:01 GMT 3
obviously that's what jakaswanga said and there's a link below to show that. but you delighted in his comments and off you went with your demonstration of how low you view women. Kathure: The streets on the edge of Patpong have numerous places where one can buy "authentic hand-made Thai crafts" (which usually turn out to have been machine-made in China). I was there to buy some of these "authentic hand-made Thai crafts". After that I stepped into the nearest pub to have a quick beer, and there I saw what I saw. I thought it would be different in other pubs, and I tried some. But, again, I saw what I saw. And Pattaya is Pattaya; it was like that before I got there, and it is still like that. You also seem to assume that "a midget, an amputee, a super-hairy, extra-thin, the most number in the shortest time... Imagination is the only limit." is all about women at the receiving end. I can assure you that it's not: gay men, gay women, straight men, straight women, ... bi, transgender, tri-whatever, and some that's not even been named yet. Everybody's at it there, getting, giving, getting-and-giving, ... All the time. It's a very equal-opportunity place. That's why Pattaya is Pattaya. I also stated Lee Kwan Yew's views on legalized prostitution; to the extent that you have a problem with those views, the person you want is Mr. Lee. As for our youth, I believe that having so many angry, idle young men is very dangerous for our country. Reasonable employment is the right way to deal with that, but, perhaps just as a short-term measure, legalized and properly regulated prostitution could let some steam out of that valve. You might consider it crude to read/hear it, but nature is nature, and the fact is that young men getting a lot of sex tend to be less angry than they would otherwise be. I understand where you are coming from, in so far as prostitution far too often leads to some of the worst abuses of women, and that is why I am for the law bring it under proper control. We can have a discussion on such things, but it doesn't help when you insist that it's all a battle between Visigoth males and Simone Weil.
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Post by OtishOtish on Sept 15, 2012 2:12:05 GMT 3
your asking me about fgm because i'm a meru or what? everybody here knows what my position on that is and i've actually aquired enemies here @ jukwaa fighting folks over their justification of the same. so just be quiet! I don't know your position. I haven't been on Jukwaa for that long, and for quite a bit of that time I was on "involuntary leave". So, I probably missed what you had to say. But I am surprised that you ignored my earlier query and that women on Jukwaa are not continually fighting for the sistren on that issue. I mean, right now women are tinkering with other women's things in of the most vile ways imaginable. I actually asked you about FGM on another thread some time back, and it had nothing to do with your being Meru. (Are Merus big on FGM?) I asked because you always seem to be fighting for women, and I can't understand why more Kenyan women are not up in arms about the issue---a very nasty, ugly business. When you stop being so angry, perhaps we could have a discussion about it. I never said that men cannot do without degrading women; I do, however, believe that they cannot do without it. If a reasonable person takes a hard, objective look at prostitution and all other secondary activities around it, the inevitable conclusion has to be that the best thing is to bring it all under the firm and proper control of the law. I consider it very unfortunate that the forward-thinking mayor or Nairobi could not get the necessary support. But, once again: I am very firmly opposed to women being forced into prostitution, and I am astonished that you somehow read that that into my comments. "need X to feel man enough" is a very tired line from angry womem. I think you can do better than that. Perhaps when you stop being so angry we can have a reasonable dicussion. Some of my observations on these matters are based on direct, personal experience. A post script to my little story above: After we parted ways, because I moved, she became friendly with a rich Arab. When I saw her a few years later, she was living in a very nice house and driving the latest Jaguar. Apparently when asked for taxi-fares, rich Arabs give enough for a Boeing 747 across town. Does this story have a moral? That's a good question, and here's the good answer: taxi-fares are costly for everyone, but rich Arabs will still over-estimate the cost of a taxi across town.
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Post by jakaswanga on Aug 18, 2013 15:31:26 GMT 3
China is described as the evolving powerhouse of the future. what we forget to add is that, it's also a kleptocracy of a scale perhaps never seen before in recent history (we are soon joining that league). As we deal with useless distractions on a daily basis, the mboys ie the looting brigade are busy at work having found in the chinese more than a willing partner in crime. someone brought this clip to my attention and it left me seething with rage. where are the local leaders? why aren't they talking? where is kalonzo the VP? why is he quiet? what is going on here? who are these kenyan owners of fenxi mining company? BTW, jukwaa has gone eerily quiet, anyone still at home? Otishotish, I know you do not like Oriental dik up Kenya's sh!t-hole, but the son of Jomo, on behalf of all citizens, just has to go and take it without squirming. It is his patriotic duty ! FDI. Foreign Direct investment, is not that the song every Governor of the county republics is singing? China, that is the guy who ejaculates FDI the most. So bend over! www.standardmedia.co.ke/?articleID=2000091259&story_title=china-kenya-ties-headed-for-better-timesHere is an idea of what the kENYAN government could change to release some money for INVESTMENT. www.standardmedia.co.ke/?articleID=2000091256&story_title=someone-poking-uhuru-kenyatta-william-ruto-soft-belly&pageNo=2GCG of Kibaki and Raila left the incomers with a monster: Austerity to release funds for investment: but we wont do it without economic reform of the basics! www.nation.co.ke/oped/Opinion/+Uhuru+must+reset+Kenyas+relationship+with+China/-/440808/1957690/-/132rm4hz/-/index.html Tales from the negotiation table! How much bribes did you come away with? LAPPSET: the mega-container port to be at Lamu, linked with a rail terminus to E&CA. The Chinese, like the Ugandans and Sudanese, quickly realised the Kenyans were joking , only interested in eating. While the jokes continue, the Chinese asked the Tanzanians if they were more serious. Try me, Kikwete grinned. Let us do it, Jin-bao said. STANDARD GAUGE RAILWAY FROM MOMBASA:Murithi Mutiga, the writer of this column in the nation, has forgotten that when Uhuru Kenyatta was minister of finance, he already made the Railway a priority, and set funds aside for it. Funds which under some former General turned Rail-CEO have dissipated. Okay, that time it was not a TOP priority, merely a priority. Top or not, that makes a whale of a difference I suppose. You want to give them to Kirinyaga Road Works company or Mugoya! Can, but will take a century! As President Uhuru Kenyatta engorges himself like a tick, courtesy of Wanjiku's $80,000 meal-ticket for the week, this loose end will come on the table. www.the-star.co.ke/news/article-132070/uhuru-cautioned-over-police-tenderall roads lead east! some buttocks face west!
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