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Post by subsaharanite on Oct 18, 2011 0:02:06 GMT 3
DW may have been right all through, but we seem to forget that we are in a forum formulated by one double O. He sets the democratic limits, he monitors every move and we are at his mercy. If Double O feels he has had enough of DW, we certainly cannot do much. We can definitely point it out to him but that's as far as we can go. In most cases, one ends up agreeing to disagree with double O and thereafter bliss prevails. A few days ago brought up a topic of members being allowed to vote on whether double O can suspend or expel a member. I soon realized it wasn't such a prudent idea after all as double O sets up the rules.
It is actually very difficult for all of us to conform to a particular notion and double O knows that. People are all different. Its particularly difficult for any moderator or administrator to know the true nature of contributors especially when some of them are here for purposes best known to them. As such, regulation of such a forum is arguably difficult. That is why sometimes when double O makes such a 'ruling' there will always be people opposed to it just as many more will be for it. The question is, what lessons do we learn from this? Is double O slowly pottering us into a form that he wants us to be?
Sometimes such actions though mundane sometimes implant a cautious conscience in one such that when they write or comment on a certain issue, they remember the possible consequences of not following the 'rules'. This in turn changes a forum from being a mere dispensation tool to a more professional board whose members understand their extent of expression.
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Post by mank on Oct 18, 2011 2:20:23 GMT 3
Something does not feel right about all this. Suddenly the environment feels too controled for comfort. However, with DW mentioning law suits I must assume there is more to this than is apparent. My appeal though is that we all should be let to know what is going on - tomorrow, may be.
To be commended, I am glad to see Oloo's confirmation that DW and AE are not one and the same. Back in the days before I joined Jukwaa I had the occassion of knocking heads with Alexander E over at the Nation forum, and would swear the person behind that name was not the same person behind DW. That notwithstanding I am always amazed by Jukwaa members who so often claim very matter-of-factly to know that a Jukwaa member X is a profile double of Jukwaa member Y. From where do they get this information?
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bagay
New Member
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Post by bagay on Oct 18, 2011 2:48:01 GMT 3
Monk qoute" I am always amazed by Jukwaa members who so often claim very matter-of-factly to know that a Jukwaa member X is a profile double of Jukwaa member Y. From where do they get this information"
I Atendened my secondary school at kisumu Technical high school. I learnt very fast folks down there will chide you once its conformed you talk too much.
It was common to hear this words" Ngani Onge Nyingi' Thoo yawa!!
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Post by okolowaka on Oct 18, 2011 2:54:26 GMT 3
It is one thing to engage people in opposing arguments...but dragging debates to the lows that DW was trying to do is not what has made Jukwaa the respectable 'blog" that it is.
DW is not the first to be kicked out, let him go do his thing elsewhere...
Thanks for fumigating the room once again OO....
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Post by einstein on Oct 18, 2011 3:27:18 GMT 3
No, Danielwaweru and Alexander Eichner are two different persons but are ideologically birds of a feather. While Waweru is more verbose and will always go to great lengths to provide a thousand links to drive his points home (except in 2 instances when he ventured into the grounds of very libellous, bar-like talk tittle-tattles and I personally waved the danger sign in his direction but which he promptly ignored), Alexander Eichner is more or less a one-liner type unless he is starting a whole new thread.
Their writing styles are as different as day and night. But, they are/were both members of KenyaImagine.com.
Personally if I find a forum too lopsided for my liking, my next action is just to quit that forum. Some members here are not being honest when they complain that Jukwaa is too pro-ODM, yet before they joined the forum they could read the views expressed therein, see that they are pro-ODM, but then go ahead and join the forum anyway, only for them to turn around and start whining that the forum is not balanced! What sort of logic is that?
Sorry about my very winded sentences today.
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Post by Onyango Oloo on Oct 18, 2011 3:47:37 GMT 3
Something does not feel right about all this. Suddenly the environment feels too controled for comfort. However, with DW mentioning law suits I must assume there is more to this than is apparent. My appeal though is that we all should be let to know what is going on - tomorrow, may be. To be commended, I am glad to see Oloo's confirmation that DW and AE are not one and the same. Back in the days before I joined Jukwaa I had the occassion of knocking heads with Alexander E over at the Nation forum, and would swear the person behind that name was not the same person behind DW. That notwithstanding I am always amazed by Jukwaa members who so often claim very matter-of-factly to know that a Jukwaa member X is a profile double of Jukwaa member Y. From where do they get this information? Man K: Please do not be a hypocrite. I am actually not as strict as I used to be. Besides, when you were visiting the country from wherever you are based, you took the trouble of seeking me out and meeting face to face- something I appreciated very much. We spent about an hour talking about many things including Jukwaa. Is the person you met at the Fiesta in the Chester House building the one you are describing? I keeping asking folks: Kwani who has imprisoned you in Jukwaa? If you feel stifled, you have a choice of leaving this forum. That is what I would do and have done in other forums. Onyango Oloo
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Post by Onyango Oloo on Oct 18, 2011 3:56:55 GMT 3
I have come across similar anti Muthamaki outbursts on every single thread and that particular offender was never kicked out not even a warning, in fact he seemed untouchable! Perhaps the lesson here is that one has to be careful not to go after the "lakeside muthamaki" hammer and tongs as DW did and they may live to a ripe old age......RIP DW ......(insert Dirge)........... Fahari: You simply amaze me. Are you the same person who was commending me on some ultra fast action regarding some offensive posting you were complaining about? Are you the same person who contacts me ever so often regarding things you do not like? When have I disappointed you? What is all this TRIBAL GARBAGE about the so called "lakeside muthamaki" Onyango Oloo
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Post by mank on Oct 18, 2011 4:33:34 GMT 3
Something does not feel right about all this. Suddenly the environment feels too controled for comfort. However, with DW mentioning law suits I must assume there is more to this than is apparent. My appeal though is that we all should be let to know what is going on - tomorrow, may be. To be commended, I am glad to see Oloo's confirmation that DW and AE are not one and the same. Back in the days before I joined Jukwaa I had the occassion of knocking heads with Alexander E over at the Nation forum, and would swear the person behind that name was not the same person behind DW. That notwithstanding I am always amazed by Jukwaa members who so often claim very matter-of-factly to know that a Jukwaa member X is a profile double of Jukwaa member Y. From where do they get this information? Man K:
Please do not be a hypocrite.
I am actually not as strict as I used to be.
Besides, when you were visiting the country from wherever you are based, you took the trouble of seeking me out and meeting face to face- something I appreciated very much.
We spent about an hour talking about many things including Jukwaa. Is the person you met at the Fiesta in the Chester House building the one you are describing?
I keeping asking folks:
Kwani who has imprisoned you in Jukwaa?
If you feel stifled, you have a choice of leaving this forum.
That is what I would do and have done in other forums.
Onyango OlooOO, You took it that I was describing you. Not the case at all. I was describing the environment, and yes, your decisions impact the environment. It was my pleasure to meet and chat with you, and must say I am grateful that you took your time for the meeting. I would definitely repeat the occasion at another opportunity. However I would be a hypocrite if because of knowing you I hesitate to voice my concerns when I have them. You know I am not a hypocrite. You should appreciate it when people who know you can actually tell you when your actions are not all pleasant. The Hitlers and Moi's could not have become the beasts they became if it were not for their enablers who kept glorifying their every move however undesirable . In this case I did not even condemn, rather I expressed a burning curiosity to know what's cooking. I hope it is my curiosity that will remain in your attention after this. Peace.
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Post by cogency on Oct 18, 2011 6:58:21 GMT 3
Sorry to say this but OO’s action here does not make sense. I know as the administrator he holds the final authority and can decide to terminate ones membership at the smallest infraction and our pleas will fall on deaf ears. As some have alluded to; such a resolution will not play very well to public perception. They might just conclude this is an ODM site and anybody not towing the line will be rejected. Sometimes you have to stand for what is right and Daniel Waweru did that. He articulated his point, researched and delivered it in a more cogent and logical manner. Even OO’s has trouble explaining why he banned Daniel Waweru so as a result we are left to speculate.
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Post by tnk on Oct 18, 2011 7:53:08 GMT 3
Sorry to say this but OO’s action here does not make sense. I know as the administrator he holds the final authority and can decide to terminate ones membership at the smallest infraction and our pleas will fall on deaf ears. As some have alluded to; such a resolution will not play very well to public perception. They might just conclude this is an ODM site and anybody not towing the line will be rejected. Sometimes you have to stand for what is right and Daniel Waweru did that. He articulated his point, researched and delivered it in a more cogent and logical manner. Even OO’s has trouble explaining why he banned Daniel Waweru so as a result we are left to speculate. personally speaking, moderation is subjective. like einstein states, many of us were on other forum, but checked out jukwaa for a while then joined based on number of criteria which includes the understanding the "specific culture" defining jukwaa. in fact the driving point for me was that the main contributors held their ground with facts where they existed, and/or solid reasoning. some of these strong positions in due course have been found baseless whereas others were right on the mark. that does not take away from the debate. however there is an increasing perception that quoting 300 articles with no chance for anyone else to counter is equivalent to "excellent research" or as is being reported here eti "opinion substantiated with research". the famed sucker-punch research is very broad unfortunately mr waweru has an overdose of what is known as "confirmation bias". we all have it, but waweru's is driven by a banal and near irrational obsession there are many definitions floating out there of confirmation bias, find one that resonates with you www.sciencedaily.com/articles/c/confirmation_bias.htmread as many as there are, then go back and read waweru's inputs and "well researched articles" am not pouring cold water on his articles, and in fact he needs to have opportunity to respond to this post, am just saying that just because no one responds to the one sided articles does not mean that different data does not exist. its just that many of us have been through most of this debate since 2007 and find no point in repeating ourselves. i think what adongo suggested was the better option, let waweru start his thread and write to his hearts content and engage those who have time and he leaves or contributes on other threads, materials relevant to the thread
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Post by kamalet on Oct 18, 2011 8:10:05 GMT 3
For the information of Adongo, I usually prefer not to be used as an example of one who does not belong to the other side and am still allowed to be in Jukwaa.
This characterisation is what ails the forum and we all need to face up with the truth.
Jukwaa has an obvious bias for ODM politics in as far as it concerns Raila Odinga - FACT.
Jukwaa does allow comment from those that do not agree with the politics of ODM and to an extent when the name Raila is mentioned - FACT.
Just because the forum has a particular bias for ODM does not mean that it ceases being objective.
HOWEVER - and this is my point of concern, it would appear that the rate at which members are expelled does show that it is those who bad mouthed ODM or Raila that seem to get the cut....bar the occassional offending sexist. At least I can count on the fingers of my one hand those that were expelled for bad mouthing PNU and Kibaki ;D
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Post by destiny on Oct 18, 2011 9:55:01 GMT 3
"Daniel Waweru is NOT Alexander Eichener and Alexander Eichener is NOT Daniel Waweru...."- ONYANGO OLOO.
Perhaps Adongo and others owe Daniel Waweru an apology for all the racist matusis unless you have contrary proof? Jukwaa has zero tolerance for trash talkers, homophobes, RACISTS, tribalists, sexists and religious bigots. I wonder where Waweru falls among that?
Anyway members should hold their final judgement until Admin cares to publish the reason why Waweru's character was "killed" off from the forum without any warning. I hope Admin will be open and publish the reason/s lest others are yanked off for similar offence.
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Post by bkichwa on Oct 18, 2011 10:31:12 GMT 3
"Daniel Waweru is NOT Alexander Eichener and Alexander Eichener is NOT Daniel Waweru...."- ONYANGO OLOO. Perhaps Adongo and others owe Daniel Waweru an apology for all the racist matusis unless you have contrary proof? Jukwaa has zero tolerance for trash talkers, homophobes, RACISTS, tribalists, sexists and religious bigots. I wonder where Waweru falls among that? Anyway members should hold their final judgement until Admin cares to publish the reason why Waweru's character was "killed" off from the forum without any warning. I hope Admin will be open and publish the reason/s lest others are yanked off for similar offence. Destiny, I concur with your post above, as with many others who are naturally surprised and puzzled by OO's move to ban Daniel Waweru. OO, when you have a moment, please give us the reason for your action. Your move to ban DW has left a blank which if left for a good number of us to fill, will lead to conclusions that have been mentioned in posts above (ODM/Raila bias, etc). Please give us reason not to believe that this is what it is about. Respectfully, the latter is important. Adongo, you have gone to great lengths to assassinate someone's character via what now appears a wrong fundamental assertion on your part (DW = Alex). And your missives in this regard have constituted the body of your explanation of why DW had to go. Now what?
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Post by mzalendo on Oct 18, 2011 10:44:22 GMT 3
"Daniel Waweru is NOT Alexander Eichener and Alexander Eichener is NOT Daniel Waweru...."- ONYANGO OLOO. Perhaps Adongo and others owe Daniel Waweru an apology for all the racist matusis unless you have contrary proof? Jukwaa has zero tolerance for trash talkers, homophobes, RACISTS, tribalists, sexists and religious bigots. I wonder where Waweru falls among that? Anyway members should hold their final judgement until Admin cares to publish the reason why Waweru's character was "killed" off from the forum without any warning. I hope Admin will be open and publish the reason/s lest others are yanked off for similar offence. Not so fast my sister destiny. I highly doubt if Onyango Oloo will accord you the previledge to elaborate in publications his reasons for kicking this man out of jukwaa. perhaps have a look at the thread about ODM nicking it in the first round. pay a particular attention to when OO announced his presence on the thread and posts before that from me, okolowaka and perhaps mzee if i am not wrong. Having been jukwaa for sometime now when OO takes the pain to inform you of his keen attention to a particular thread, first of all you should ask youself why? the first thing i will think about myself is to remember that he is the adminstrator and if at all he was interested in posting on a particular thread, it is not usual for him to announce that he is following the discussion. So this actually a case of a soldier shooting himself on the foot out of sheer recklessness.
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Post by b6k on Oct 18, 2011 13:55:12 GMT 3
Folks it's a pity DW wasn't given an opportunity to defend himself. The transition from admin monitoring the thread to off with his head pre-empted any response from him.
Anyway all that's spilt milk now. What's curious though is if DW wasn't axed for fake handles as OO states he wasn't Alexander Eichner (as unjustly alleged by a co-admin, Adongo, who has admin rights & can tell IP addresses, etc & thus shouldn't make false allegations) then what was his sin? OO, I think that's all folks want to know before they move on, or you throw a padlock on this thread...
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Post by tactician on Oct 18, 2011 14:54:54 GMT 3
"Daniel Waweru is NOT Alexander Eichener and Alexander Eichener is NOT Daniel Waweru...."- ONYANGO OLOO. Perhaps Adongo and others owe Daniel Waweru an apology for all the racist matusis unless you have contrary proof? Jukwaa has zero tolerance for trash talkers, homophobes, RACISTS, tribalists, sexists and religious bigots. I wonder where Waweru falls among that? Anyway members should hold their final judgement until Admin cares to publish the reason why Waweru's character was "killed" off from the forum without any warning. I hope Admin will be open and publish the reason/s lest others are yanked off for similar offence. Destiny, I concur with your post above, as with many others who are naturally surprised and puzzled by OO's move to ban Daniel Waweru. OO, when you have a moment, please give us the reason for your action. Your move to ban DW has left a blank which if left for a good number of us to fill, will lead to conclusions that have been mentioned in posts above (ODM/Raila bias, etc). Please give us reason not to believe that this is what it is about. Respectfully, the latter is important. Adongo, you have gone to great lengths to assassinate someone's character via what now appears a wrong fundamental assertion on your part (DW = Alex). And your missives in this regard have constituted the body of your explanation of why DW had to go. Now what? i concur with what has been said above. As it stands, i am yet to see any reason for the ban of daniel waweru. Combined with the rather obvious bias given that we have seen others make ridiculous pro-ODM hoaxes, it is rather clear to me where this is going. Add the ''cry me a river'' by OO who is the admin and that if anyone is dissatisfied should leave and it is obvious where we are headed. In protest to this ''UTA DO?'' attitude, I am going dormant and will not comment again on this forum. I will not sit on the fence and thereby aid & abet dictatorship. I will remain a silent reader aka lurker until the dictatorship ends. Till next time.
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Post by kasuku on Oct 18, 2011 15:32:48 GMT 3
There is indeed no discrimination in Jukwaa. Even high school youth may join... But in honest, Are we not all mature enough personalities who take own responsibility? Daniel waweru is taking the consequences of his own doing and I don’t think he needs anyone to rebel for him.
I can understand that DW was a role model for his fan club here. Well there is always a follower...
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Post by nereah on Oct 18, 2011 15:34:51 GMT 3
tactician?
nereah here and nice seeing you around.quiet frankly i am saddened that you too have also lined up in the queue to throw the kitchen sink at the admin.
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Post by enigma on Oct 18, 2011 15:52:08 GMT 3
DW made the allegation that a certain personality had paid people to throw children into latrines. The evidence adduced by himself to support his claims did not quite reach any reasonable threshold. I think he had to go on the basis of the seriousness of his unfounded allegations. Otherwise there will be more and more claims from people slandering personalities in a forum where they have no right of reply.
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Post by akinyi2005 on Oct 18, 2011 16:51:12 GMT 3
OO, you have made a decision and frankly am surprised that this non-issue continues to dominate debate on jukwaa for the second day. People, you all know OO and by now should realize that he isn't about to change his mind`. So what if DW's behind has been kicked he's not the first neither will he be the last so let the matter roll off your backs . am sure those of you who are already missing DW know where to find him to continue enjoying his articles.
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Post by Onyango Oloo on Oct 18, 2011 17:04:11 GMT 3
Jukwaa attracts a cross section of people propagating a multiplicity of views-ranging from the sublime to the outlandish covering the full ideological spectrum from the demented far right to the paranoid far left.
In the Kenyan context, you have people who are card carrying members of ODM and PNU to many more who more or less espouse fairly independent views.
Jukwaa is also a moderated platform and it is often a tough call when it comes to making a decision of when to pull a piece down, put somebody on suspension or kick them out all together from Jukwaa.
On Monday, October 17, 2011 I yanked Daniel Waweru, a well known name in Kenyan blogosphere circles from Jukwaa.
Some reacted with glee, while there were those still reeling with shock.
Daniel Waweru himself (when I was googling around, I found out from the Guardian website that this is a pseudonym) contacted me via the gmail chat service to inquire into the reasons behind his banning from Jukwaa.
I promised to write to him giving a context and reason for the seemingly drastic action.
To understand where I am coming from, you need to forget about Daniel Waweru for a second and rewind back to those tense and hectic days just after the announcement of Presidential election results in late December 2007 and early January 2008.
Jukwaa was abuzz with lots of faction based exchanges as members traded accusations, claims, counter claims, conspiracy theories and tribal epithets. We became part of the online frontier of the post-election violence itself.
Because I am the administrator of Jukwaa, and I happen to have a Luo ethnic background, I became the subject of tirades-some of it quite nasty- from those who felt I was carrying Raila Odinga’s water.
Of course it was not a one sided torrent-we had exchanges of views, some of it quite robust.
Beyond these heated debates, I detected a particular focus emanating from a clutch of individuals associated with a particular Kenyan blog called Kenya Imagine. I was to later meet one of these individuals in person. The laser like target of the Kenya Imagine folks was Jukwaa with the singular aim of portraying us as a HATE SITE spewing forth genocidal anti-Gikuyu propaganda. One particular individual, Alexander Eichener, picked me, Onyango Oloo as his favourite punching bag. You can access these exchanges by going back to our archives and searching using the key words “Alexander Eichener”. I was not the only person under attack, but I am just restricting this to my person for very obvious reasons.
At one point these exchanges bogged down broader discussions until some members started suspecting that this was a DELIBERATE attempt to either hijack Jukwaa or keep it hostage to these accusations and counter accusations.
Initially, I dealt with the issue by allowing and even participating in these debates. But this only added petroleum to the digital inferno already raging.
Eventually I made a decision to kick Alexander out of Jukwaa. I also pulled down quite a number of postings and blocked several people from the forum.
I saw immediate results: some members who had boycotted Jukwaa resumed their participation; the “noise” as it were died down and exchanges became much calmer.
Since that time, there have of course been other controversies, disruptions etc, but not quite to the scale of 2007-2008.
That is how things have been until Daniel Waweru’s intervention a few days ago.
At the outset, I followed the conversation silently, but with growing alarm.
Why?
Because Daniel was basically regurgitating Alexander Eichener’s lines from 2007-2008. Even as I contemplated what to do, I was bombarded with private mail from members who were noticing the same trend.
Reflecting on the toxic atmosphere of the earlier period, I decided, first to signal an oblique warning, and then to act by yanking Daniel Waweru from Jukwaa sending a clear message that the forum was NOT going to be held hostage to the same exchanges of yesteryear.
The similarity in terms of form and content between Alex and Daniel is what led some people to conclude that they are one and the same person.
Please note that Daniel Waweru is the Chief Editor at Kenya Imagine where Alexander was a contributor during the post-election violence period, hence it is not entirely surprising that they should espouse similar views.
Some of you may remember recently that a member, with obvious ODM sympathies took it upon himself to paste images of the victims of Naivasha being burnt to a cinder.
I immediately REMOVED these offending graphics.
As I write this, I notice a counter-offensive against the Administrator using Daniel Waweru as a battering ram. There is an attempt to turn this into a freedom of expression and censorship issue with undertones of tribalism and partisan bias on my part by those who are still deluded enough to think that Onyango Oloo is ODM's and Raila Odinga’s point man on the World Wide Web.
I stand by my decision and if another person, be it an Ochieng, Mogaka, Luseno, Sapalan, Patel, Kishushe, Amina, Nanjala or Wangeci intervened in the same way I would pull down the guillotine with equal ferociousness on their hapless neck.
Since I am not in the popularity sweepstakes, I will not be sobbing in my bathroom because of a few jibes and snide remarks from those who do not like my decision.
So there you have it:
WHAT LED TO DANIEL WAWERU BEING FLUNG OUT OF JUKWAA.
Onyango Oloo Jukwaa Administrator
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Post by adongo23456 on Oct 18, 2011 18:14:30 GMT 3
Oloo, Thanks for stating your reasons. I was actually going to explain a few things seeing as my name has been cited a couple times but I just couldn't get the time. Now that you have explained matters I see no reason to bother with all that. I have my reasons to say what I said and see no reason to apologize to anybody. But I will spare this board a rehearsal of the whole circus. I stand by my comments. Others have the right to do whatever they deem fit including quiting Jukwaa altogether or not posting. I did that for many months and Jukwaa was doing just great if not better. It is a free world. Now to: 6bk,Just so you know adongo is not a co-admnistrator of this board as you are claiming. Talk about false allegations. Oloo offered me the responsibility but I respectfully declined precisely because of what you have just done. I know some folks would accuse me of using the admin privilleges whatever they are to say things that I say and which of course I will NOT stop saying. So I publicly announced here when another member of jukwaa accused me of the same thing you have done incidentally on another issue of dual handles and mischief in Jukwaa. I told everybody I had never been and I have no interest in the bisuness of admin and Oloo confirmed that adongo declined the offer and never even once used the admin password because I do not have any and refused even to look at it. Let me say this. To me Jukwaa is part of a whole range of work we do with a whole bunch of people out there. I take it seriously. It is not a place I come to blow steam or angage in ego trips or heckling(even that is serious business). It is a place I come to do what I think is good work for the country. I have been in this line of work for decades and it has taken many forms and many challenges. I have been wrong a million times in my take on some things and will be 2 more million times. But that is part of the work. This kind of stuff is in my blood. I come here to work. Thank you. Folks it's a pity DW wasn't given an opportunity to defend himself. The transition from admin monitoring the thread to off with his head pre-empted any response from him. Anyway all that's spilt milk now. What's curious though is if DW wasn't axed for fake handles as OO states he wasn't Alexander Eichner (as unjustly alleged by a co-admin, Adongo, who has admin rights & can tell IP addresses, etc & thus shouldn't make false allegations) then what was his sin? OO, I think that's all folks want to know before they move on, or you throw a padlock on this thread...
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Post by b6k on Oct 18, 2011 19:57:50 GMT 3
OO, chapter closed...
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Post by b6k on Oct 18, 2011 20:02:55 GMT 3
Adongo, thanks for the clarification. Mistook the green stars & moderator tag to mean you held some admin rights.
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Post by gemagema on Oct 18, 2011 22:50:45 GMT 3
The expulsion of Daniel waweru aka kenyaimagine editor actually takes me by surprise too. It is a pity that he had to be kicked out. His political affiliations and hence arguments were definitely different from mine, notwithstanding, they were contributory to the political talk in place, moreso representative of a large percent of our Kenyan populace. And this, we need to hear and counter if need be.
While I respect the fact that OO has to administrate this forum in a manner that does not lead to hate and civil abuse like was the case on many online discussions before and during PEV, DW should have been given an opportunity to amend. Anga ka-warning, halafu suspension, na ka mbaya, expulsion. Judging from the way and number of times that DW contributed to threads, even if sometimes with an intention to kill a thread, he did seem to enjoy being on Jukwaa. It is not common to get active online political contributors like DW in many online communities, yet active citizen participation is good for our democracy. Jukwaa itself, has a very large passive membership. If one could read south african blogs and online newspapers commentaries, you would then realise that DW wasnt bad at all, kionjo tuu.
Hata hivyo, as members, we have no choice but respect the rules set by administration. The same is the case with where I live now, - am currently sojourning in a land other than mine, and while here, I must live by the law of the land. The same way Ocampo 6 behaved accordingly while at ICC - they showed no contempt that they would have otherwise shown in kenyan courts
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