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Post by maina on Apr 3, 2006 4:26:42 GMT 3
Job, They say that when a person begins to throw mud at someone else, he does not only get his hands dirty, he also loses a lot of gorund! Now why are you blunderingly and desperately goosing me into your mud-throwing?
Firstly, my explicit insinuation of sitting back and watching your self-indulgent crusade for Raila Odinga is exactly that. I meant what I said and I said what I meant. It is my opinion that there are a number of Raila Odinga mouthpieces and substitutes who have a self-arrogated role of crusading for his exclusivism with respect to his venture for the presidency. It is also my opinion that you, Job, are one of these crusaders! That is therefore not amazing to me, personally, but it is welcomed since you are entitled to do as you wish, all in the name of democracy!
Like I said in my previous thread, you are of course deservedly very free to continue propunding theories and fantasies of Uhuru Kenyatta as you wish! I believe that I am accurate in my presentation. There is nothing explicit or implicit in the exclusivity of my presentation to deem it an expedition on Uhuru’s behalf. I recall having told you that before!
Besides, if Kalonzo Musyoka and Uhuru want to forge a “strategic” alliance in the aegis of conscientious politics and self-preservation, why is it soooo problematic for Job? Wacha tu!
Do you know that you actually sound sooooo like Raila Odinga when he is out and about Kenya? And just curious, what are you and Raila Odinga panicking about. He's out there campaigning, holding two rallies in day!!!! And then here you are constructing extraneous write-ups packed with contortionism and purposeless analyses! Surely, what's up with you folks? Is the mwananchi so brainless?
I maintain and will continue to sit back and watch your crusades for Raila Odinga! I'll save my gorgeous hands for messier mud-throwing. That’s all!
Maina
-unedited-
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Post by dubois on Apr 3, 2006 9:12:14 GMT 3
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Post by abdulmote on Apr 3, 2006 9:46:39 GMT 3
"Now Abdulmote, Habari? I challenge you (humbly of course), to prove that Kalonzo Musyoka took part, or was part of any process or machination to fleece the mwananchi. Besides, you need to take a look at his assets before you knock him down. That's pretty much why I maintain that he is "untainted".
As for Uhuru, shall you and I surely condemn and incriminate him for his father's sins? C'mon!" Maina
I should say asante to job, he has done a fine 'job' in responding to you about Uhuru. But maybe I should also add that apart from his vast business empire which he has acquired through the grabbing his old man had efficiently undertaken when president, Uhuru has never demonstrated any active inclinations for the poor mwananchi. In fact the only thing I can recall about him is that he was thrown into the political limelight by Daniel Toroitich for reasons which he best knew! Apart from that, the filthy rich young man did not have a clue as to what politics was all about. OK, perhaps being the son of Jomo Kenyatta may have boosted his ratings for some naive reasons as usual Kenyan style. But that should not necessarily make him a prince in waiting! The rest utajaza mwenyewe.
As to Kalonzo, tell me, could I have been dreaming to know that he was once a cabinet in Moi's gover which stole and stole from the public? Oh, Ok, he's "clean". For God's sake I don't have a clue as to why all these so called ODMs want to become the presidents. Tell me please, what are they about to bring for us that we haven't recieved from their once beloved and "competent president" Kibaki?
Lakinin ni kwanini that somehow almost everyone has to be supporting someone for one reason or another even though they may be corrupt through various indications? Why do we have to be so partisan irrespective of the obvious eh?
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Post by Onyango Oloo on Apr 3, 2006 16:30:19 GMT 3
Maina:
having stated my opinions very clearly, i will steer away from the personal mudslinging that you are so desperately trying to drag me into.
Onyango Oloo Nairobi, Kenya
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Post by maina on Apr 3, 2006 18:56:21 GMT 3
"Now Abdulmote, Habari? I challenge you (humbly of course), to prove that Kalonzo Musyoka took part, or was part of any process or machination to fleece the mwananchi. Besides, you need to take a look at his assets before you knock him down. That's pretty much why I maintain that he is "untainted".
As for Uhuru, shall you and I surely condemn and incriminate him for his father's sins? C'mon!"Maina I should say asante to job, he has done a fine 'job' in responding to you about Uhuru. But maybe I should also add that apart from his vast business empire which he has acquired through the grabbing his old man had efficiently undertaken when president, Uhuru has never demonstrated any active inclinations for the poor mwananchi. In fact the only thing I can recall about him is that he was thrown into the political limelight by Daniel Toroitich for reasons which he best knew! Apart from that, the filthy rich young man did not have a clue as to what politics was all about. OK, perhaps being the son of Jomo Kenyatta may have boosted his ratings for some naive reasons as usual Kenyan style. But that should not necessarily make him a prince in waiting! The rest utajaza mwenyewe. As to Kalonzo, tell me, could I have been dreaming to know that he was once a cabinet in Moi's gover which stole and stole from the public? Oh, Ok, he's "clean". For God's sake I don't have a clue as to why all these so called ODMs want to become the presidents. Tell me please, what are they about to bring for us that we haven't recieved from their once beloved and "competent president" Kibaki? Lakinin ni kwanini that somehow almost everyone has to be supporting someone for one reason or another even though they may be corrupt through various indications? Why do we have to be so partisan irrespective of the obvious eh? Why does it seem that you want us to discuss Job's foundationless suspicions about Uhuru as though they are sooooo important? Surely, is it our life support? Ugh! Please Abdulmote, do not tell me that you're now attacking me based on the dirty pools, the dirty tricks as well as the pursuit of indiscriminate muckraking as part the smear campaigns that are so characteristic with Raila Odinga! Don't you know that that is the groundplan of Raila Odinga politics, Railaphobia and its mania? Have you ever heard him (Raila) initiate anything substantial in his speeches (ever) besides his emblematic yawping on the basis of faults elicited by other politicians, groups, and communities, which he uses to propel his clout sequentially resulting in the Railaphobia and its mania? Haven't you noticed that even right here in Jukwaa, some of his traditionalists that he has soooo wonderfully psychologized are even audaciously purporting to die for their wild dreams to see him president? Raila exemplifies the makings of a good warden who diligently watches the amoury but he just can't sit behind the General's desk because he doesn't have the sixth sense that is awfully crucial for planning and engaging in a tactful combat! Ever heard the saying that not all people are born with common sense and that they need to get out there, get burnt a little and know what fire is? That's exactly what Raila Odinga and his clout need to do - to learn! May I therefore kindly suggest that you just sit back and watch the drama that's about to unfold in Kenya? May I also suggest that you must pooh pooh the angst that is generated by reading from Raila's mouthpieces and substitutes in the future? Ala! You must save your precious "asantes" for the real deal! About what your referring to here as Uhuru's lack of demonstration to the poor mwananchi........................do you know how much he (yes, Uhuru) and KANU donated and continue to donate for our Kenya folks that are dying of hunger in N. Eastern Province? Can anybody else match what he (that implicitly includes his efforts to) has contributed? Or wait a minute, are you now going to blame his contributions as amounting from the illicit wealth his father acquired? Halafu, what about what he, his wife, and his mother do with respect to street children and orphans in Kenya? What about the borehole projects he instituted in the northern parts of the Rift valley, Eastern and N. Eatern provinces? What about he and his family's development projects in the Coast (the Pokomo community)? Ugh! You mean you purport to develop an understanding of your politicans in Kenya believing in Job's heresay and chimera? C'mon! Halafu Oloo, There's no mudslinging I am desperately trying to drag you into. Hapana, you know very well I have nothing against you. Like I said earlier, you have recently possessed an uncivilized addiction of attacking Kalonzo Musyoka's personal belief, faith and its exclusivity, with awful contortionism while hiding behind your own worldview! That is disrespectful and arrogant! You are free to attack the Christian faith (I have no problem with that at all), but you have no grounds whatsoever of attacking Kalonzo Musyoka's personal belief, faith and its exclusivity! Maina -unedited-
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Post by job on Apr 3, 2006 18:57:25 GMT 3
Maina,
I'll take you back to what you said a while back, on this very thread;
Quoting you; "I will personally not comment on this matter any more than I already have. You are of course deservedly very free to continue propunding theories and fantasies of Uhuru Kenyatta as you wish! I believe that I am accurate in my presentation. "
Since you have already flip-flopped right here, let me state to you that I have no time to propound theories and fantasies about your hero and Presidential hopeful Uhuru Kenyatta.
I have told you exactly who & what Uhuru Kenyatta is all about,... based on information in the public domain. He is not the Saint you want people to believe he is, as you continue marketing HIM as one of the ONLY two clean, corruption-free, and resourceful political grandstanders. That is ridiculously the joke of the year.
Your screaming hypocrisy on this issue is reaching shameful proportions. IF ANYONE IS PROPOUNDING FANTASIES IN JUKWAA, IT IS EXACTLY YOU. Where did Job claim that Raila is clean, corruption-free,...blah blah blah. Lets stop playing Smart Alecks here.
You are the one waxing lyrical about ONLY so and so, is clean, only so and so is rich and even naively claiming to speak on behalf of FIVE PROVINCES of Kenya and prophesizing (even confirming personally,...your own words) on how they will vote. Are you assuming you are addressing a bunch of simpletons!
Just revist the outrageous remarks you have been making on this very thread then come back (notwithstanding your earlier statement not to) and expound on those wild "FACTS" you proclaimed,.. ati saa hii.
Go slow on your own grandstanding. Nobody in Jukwaa has a monopoly of ideas. Nobody can thrust Uhuru, Raila or any other politician onto the Kenyan people by force, ....just ask Moi. You can't even force connish ideas onto Kenyans,.... if you have doubts ask Kibaki and his Banana Cabinet.
Back to your crown prince (President-in-waiting) Uhuru. Do you think Kenyans are so beautifully stupid they don't realize why Uhuru is sooooo resourceful in cash, assets, & land? Give us a break!
Uhuru is simply the hope for the Kenyatta and Moi family dynasties to continue exploiting the resources of Kenya. Nothing is in it for Kenyans, period! It's about two families in a country of over 30 million.
Their agenda is simple,.....Hemorrhaging the country to bones. Protecting what they have already grabbed, and running Kenya as a family enterprise, using Kenyatta & Moi's very doctrines of;....... divide the tribes and rule them, .....sycophant's get bread crumbs, dissenters get marginalized, ......yaani the patronage bulls@%t
I'll must also say that, like Kibaki,..... Uhuru and Moi would not wish to see Kenya change it's Katiba. Haven't you noticed Moi's sudden about-turn on the process of making the Katiba,.....from Foreign Experts to...... the people themselves. Having realized what is in the minds of wananchi, Moi has now flip-flopped to side with the people.
None of these folks is genuinely standing with wananchi on the process of having a people driven Katiba. They would love the status-quo to prevail,...to safeguard the avenues of fleecing the public coffers as usual. TUMEWAONA, na TUNAWAJUA.
This is the year 2006, not 19-seventy-something my buddy. The people stuck in the 70's mentality like akina Kibaki are seeing for themselves how that warped thinking cannot just work.
Lastly, just keep on believing that Uhuru is corruption-free, and the only hope for Kenya's salvation. Time will tell.
unedited.
Job.
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Post by ker7emmo on Apr 3, 2006 19:50:50 GMT 3
That William Ruto is a Moi lackey is a lie that is only based on a distrust/ hatred for Rift Valley people. I am sure the same would be said for Kilimo if she was to go off on her own platform. William Ruto was a constant pain in Moi's flesh, and a radical even when in the Cabinet. Did he not resign twice from his position as Assistant Minister? It is only out of a desire to consolidate Rift Valley votes for Uhuru that he was made important in the days immediately preceding the last elections. It is Uhuru and not Ruto who is the former President's point man, as has been shown time and time again, including the recent dismissal by Moi of Ruto's ambitions.
The trouble with any attempts at democracy in ODM, is that it will not be based on equal votes. Railla's vote will count for more than any of the others. If you doubt me, ask one son of Nyandusi,or Muthengi for that matter.
The real question we are not asking is this, is Raila really serious about gunning for the Presidency? It is obvious by now that he has fallen out with Kalonzo, perhaps disappointed that Kalonzo does not dance to his ditty, but who has caught his eye?
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Post by job on Apr 3, 2006 20:13:04 GMT 3
Folks, Maina has finally let the cat out of the bag. Be the judge. I noticed that Maina outlined a looong list of "development record" that Uhuru Kenyatta has taken to NEP, Nairobi and Coast? Wow? Ati boreholes, childrens homes, and the kind of stuff that campaigning councillors sell to grandmothers when seeking their votes. I'll repost a thread about this darling favourite of Maina,...... Uhuru Kenyatta, for another perspective before I proceed; www.nationaudio.com/elections/moisuccession/MoiSuccession_Uhuru56.htmlAti Saint Uhuru Kenyatta must be Kenya's next saviour and President. And we must nyamaza and lie low like envelopes as Maina tells us saa hii, what is really happening, who is corruption-free and who has the cash to win a presidential election and who is best placed to lead Kenya,....and that is none other than Uhuru. I'll maintain, that's another joke no different from the Kibaki circus. However, why is Maina trying to influence the thinking of a fellow debator (Abdulmote), an independent, neutral and intelligent thinker who has graced Jukwaa for a looong time? Because he didn't find time to even read Abdulmote's parting shot, when he (Abdul) asked why debators are aligning themselves to political personalities (just as they did with Kibaki) as if that will save the country. Maina may think that Abdulmote is such a simpleton who easily gets duped by Job's "Railamanic" postings. But I will tell Maina that Job will repeatedly expose politics of deception and grandstanding by johny-come-lately "professor-know-it-all" cons. Calling other debators, mouthpieces of so and so, and belittling their arguments as foundationless etc etc. while coming out openly and desperately trying to market Uhuru Kenyatta (in very poor fashion) is not only hypocritical but shameful. Maina has all the democratic right to support Uhuru, but should learn to be tolerant of what other say of Uhuru without spinning the debate from Uhuru to the personality posting the contrary position. Search this post for any rebuttal or fact proving just how Uhuru is clean and you will find none. All you get is a statement from Maina, ati 'I believe uhuru is clean", "I stand by that 'fact'"......but nothing of substance to support the remarks. On the contrary , statements in the public domain (posted here) bare allegations on the contrary, .....suggesting quite suspect business links, corrupt dealings and links to Mungiki by Uhuru. Is that surely cause for the seething anger and craziness from Maina? Let me tell Maina that he can never suppress my freedom of expression, even if he spits fire. I will stick to my arguments, Sir. I've searched for any substance, in Maina's postings about the two politicians he claims are THE ONLY fit candidates (Clean, visionary, corruption-free, etc) and FOUND NONE. I seriously mean it, NONE ,........all there is..........is a depiction of what I have been treated to by the power cabal (Mount Kenya Mafia) that has occupied Kenya's political realm for the last three years,..............that is ; arrogant tribalism, tribal chauvinism, greed for power, hatred for others, intolerance to contrary view-points, name-calling & abuse of opponents, attempts to force down our throats some ethnic-hegemonic positions, grand-posturing, and clearly blatant self-elevation & assumption of some imaginary sacred status. We are watching,........be my guest. unedited. Job PS I think I've joined akina Alex and Kamale to the Senior member status of Jukwaa through this 200th, posting.
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Post by ker7emmo on Apr 3, 2006 20:31:19 GMT 3
Job, I am only very new here, I don't think I even merit a chevron,let alone a star, but you and Oloo's love for Raila is only very thinly veiled.
On the other hand, thank you for finishing off Uhuru so ruthlessly. I have always wanted to do so but lacked the requisite ammo. For me it is the greatest shame that there exist Kenyans who would want Uhuru to be president,his campaigns prosecuted with the blood and sweat of Wanjiku.
Sasa if you can do the same for Kalonzo,without mentioning silly things like receiving bullet-proof vests from mercenaries, you will have done Kenyan democracy a great service.
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Post by maina on Apr 3, 2006 20:33:43 GMT 3
Job, I find it hard to comprehend how you cannot understand and fathom the simple and plain fact that I personally do not envision any grandstander in Kenya today as legitimate to govern our winning country! You must understand that that begins with Raila Odinga and end with Uhuru Kenyatta. I have clearly stated that for you many times before! I think even Abdulmote will attest to the fact that I have overtly declared that as my position. So where do you begin to rationalize that I am ringing doorbells for Uhuru? Of his charity work, isn't it a fact that he has spent quite some cash in development projects? Do facts change when it suddenly becomes convenient to change them? Gosh!!!
Like I told you ealier and will maintain as well as continue to tell you until you get it, I will personally not comment on this whole matter any more than I already have. You are of course deservedly very free to continue propunding theories and fantasies of Uhuru Kenyatta, as well as throw up whenever you read my posts about Uhuru or Kalonzo! I believe that I am accurate in my presentation. Besides truth by definition is exclusive.
Maina.
P.S. ker7emmo, that is a very intersting observation. I have heard a lot of people asking that same question lately!
-unedited-
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Post by ker7emmo on Apr 3, 2006 20:44:51 GMT 3
Maina,it will be sufficient to call me emmo.
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Post by job on Apr 3, 2006 21:28:59 GMT 3
Maina,
On whether you are ringing doorbells for Uhuru or not, .......be not the judge,....let every reader who follows this thread be the judge. The record is right here. There are indeed minds in jukwaa that can discern from words.
As for charity,......I am yet to hear of any politician who doesn't claim to engage in some form of charity work, one way or another. Even Mobutu, Sadam, Obote and Moi were really visibly philanthropic and active in charity contributions. But they all surely engaged more actively in other things beside charity work, some not even fit for public mention.
Please get it for heavens sake, I'm not propounding theories or fantasies about Uhuru Kenyatta. Search the public domain and read the link I posted before you accuse me of dreaming up or concorcting stories about Uhuru. Did I write up those allegations in the Daily Nation and all others already in the public domain? I hope your answer is as genuine as it should be.
The issue here should not be about you, me, whether one throws up or not,...but about the political grandstanders mentioned in the thread, and we are none of them.
Ker7emmo,
I don't think I suggested that I received any medals here, all there is,......... is that when you post a certain number of articles, the membership status changes from,.....new member,... to full member , to senior member etc etc.
On the other issue,
I'm not a fan of the current patronage system of governance in Kenya, which creates unnecessary ethnic tensions each time elections near over and over again,.....then false alliances,.....then betrayals of peoples aspirations,...and the wanton destruction of the country continues. It is a circus.
We need an overhaul of the entire system through a change of the constitution (as per the people's wish, & not the ruling class) to build institutions and power and resource-sharing governance systems,.......this will lead to sharing of the nations wealth, and reduce the strains of winner-takes-all competitive politics.
Any politician or Mwananchi active in effecting this change whether it is Raila, Kalonzo, Godana or anyone else, is with me, without veiling anything. Anyone against this, ......I believe,.... is against the goodwill of the entire nation. Since I'm human, I'm only cautious, since i cannot tell for sure who is genuine or not in the Katiba debate,....but history has taught me to be cautious about certain indicators that i never hesitate to point out.
Without fundamental changes in the constitution,.......then we are just being treated to the same circus over and over again, and believe me,..none of those individuals, being touted as clean or not, all of them including Raila,.......will not take Kenya to prosperity through this patronage system we have.
I have beef with all those politicians,.....but I converge in fundamental aspirations with few of them,..that's all.
Job
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Post by aeichener on Apr 3, 2006 21:30:58 GMT 3
Well done, Job, well done here. Thanks!
Alexander
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Post by pharlap on Apr 4, 2006 1:11:57 GMT 3
The spectators always know what the players ought to do in order to score. Keep at it boys.
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Post by ker7emmo on Apr 4, 2006 6:44:01 GMT 3
I do not know of the particular truth of Oloo's allegation that Kalonzo is linked to the Christian Right in America( although I certainly remember the weight of shame I felt when he promised the US our troops for their capaign in Iraq. This nexus if you like,of politics and religion is new to our nation,and for its newness doubly dangerous.
Frank Herbert Dune
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Post by kipsang on Apr 4, 2006 6:59:10 GMT 3
Job, Like I told you ealier and will maintain as well as continue to tell you until you get it, I will personally not comment on this whole matter any more than I already have. You are of course deservedly very free to continue propunding theories and fantasies of Uhuru Kenyatta, as well as throw up whenever you read my posts about Uhuru or Kalonzo! I believe that I am accurate in my presentation. Besides truth by definition is exclusive. Maina. P.S. ker7emmo, that is a very intersting observation. I have heard a lot of people asking that same question lately! -unedited- Gosh Maina!!! don't be that @#$% that makes the loudest noise.. with no melody and rhythm, if some people here are mouth pieces to Raila why vilify them, without any serious attempt to show the falsehood in their augments, why do you want us to believe on the purity of Uhuru and your brother in faith ? If you have to defend them then give us facts we dont know in plain english.. Jesus is one of the greatest philosophers not for the Miracles, but by his Simplicity, even young children would grasp his plausible parables and his single message of repentance and hope. Kipsang EDITED
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Post by politicalmaniac on Apr 4, 2006 7:05:47 GMT 3
Nowhere in this thread has the potential of the GEMA vote and KM been adressed. KM dark horse may be the GEMA vote rather than the shifty Kalenjin vote.
Being a pliant, spineless fellow (who interestingly was "emboldened, his spine stiffened" - and his balls "spruced up" by Raila) GEMA leaders may "allow" KM to front their interests in the belief that they can manipulate him, Rasputin style. That may make the 07' elections very interesting to watch.
The GEMA vote may turn out to be the ace up KM sleeve and shock a lot of pundits
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Post by Onyango Oloo on Apr 4, 2006 10:20:21 GMT 3
Please note that JUKWAA specifically discourages ad hominem attacks that pander to ethnic passions. Stop dragging people's names where they do not belong.
Onyango Oloo Nairobi, Kenya
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Post by abdulmote on Apr 4, 2006 11:12:38 GMT 3
My dear Kenyans, greetings to you all. Its nice to have a good breakfast every morning whenever possible, and Jukwaa makes my favourite portion every now and again. Job brother, once again may I say thank you soo much for your crisp and apt response you have given above. Your courage says it all and indeed it is soothing to observe such neutrality and honesty of the mind whenever honestly and openly declared. I say keep it up brother, for Kenya such is the only genuine and sustainable hope! maina you dissappoint me my friend on your stance re Uhuru. The grounds you have attempted to offer in here that Uhuru is an ideal candidate through the recognition of his philanthropic status is nothing but a sad and pathetic sham. Otherwise were we to apply similar logic to yours, then perhaps we should also ask ourselves how much akina Pattni and Moi have also contributed in such gestures and then consider how we can elevate the same as representatives of our people! Besides, we cannot simply ignore the real source of his wealth and statr praising him whenever he give an unknown fraction of the same back! Pleaeese! Just take a pause, this is certainly a sickening thought! But you know what brother, don't despair too much in redeeming your goodself of the blunder. Perhaps I should remind you that we are indeed human and all are capable of committing one from time to time. Just relax, take a deep breath and let it go if you may not gather the courage to openly pull out! Ask Oloo, he had been there before, no big deal! On the other hand, another alternative is to dig in and sink deeper by the word! YOU SIMPLY CANNOT SELL UHURU TO US, the way Moi attempted to sell him to Kenyans, your 'good' half hearted declarations aside! Going back to the point of our discourse, I must admit that I genuinely get really sad whenever I log into some online pages and find that people are busy spending loads of hours deliberating on the merits or demerits of the individual leaders vis a vis their potential as Kenya's presidents. It is in fact my strong belief and conviction that not any or a sinlge one of what we have on offer is at all capable of salvaging our beloved nation as some would have liked us to believe. Indeed "corruption tainted" or not, I do not believe that such a tag should be the sole criterion with which we should be using in selecting who the "chosen one" and ideal candidate should be! As a reminder to those who may have forgotten, was it not just the other day when Kenyans were speaking in similar tongues with regard to Kibaki? Were we not repeating with misplaced courage and apparent false confidence that at least Kibaki is one of those who was "never tainted" by the KANU's corruption scandals but only to realise otherwise? Now look, some are even blaming Raila for something that we all in fact shared during his declaration of "Kibaki tosha"! But again I shall attempt to remind you as I always try to, that let us not blind ourselves with our leaders' immediate political travesties and concentrate on the real indications of who and what they really are. Let us have the courage of scrutinising them beyond their groomed faces and try to ask ourselves the right questions as well as have the courage to accept the right and honest answers that may soberly come about them! For example just to sample a few; what is Kalonzo bringing forth which is new that we may begin to base our fresh hopes in his leadership? How long has he been there and what had he been standing for which demonstrates his passion for the people's welfare? How critical had he been all along of the system that was in place, which in fact he was part of and how "uncomfortable" had he appeared to be with it? Did he not remain with the same to the last minute before abandoning it together with Raila but only after obviously failing to get what they had desperately yearned for from Moi? I cannot stop to wonder what would have been the scenario had they not left after Moi giving them what they had desired together with the rest of Ex KANUs<currently ODMs! But that is not all my fellow country beings. DID WE NOT VOTE FOR THE WHOLE REPACKAGED THIEVING LOT by the name of NARC, believing them to be our new hope and salvation, only to wake up to reality and regrets a few months later??!! Was it not far failure of asking ourselves these very same questions and the lack of courage of confronting the real answers that we have taken such a self destructive leap and are about to do the same this time again? Uhuru, Raila, Kalonzo???!! What are they that you do not know of or have never known which should leave you wonderring??!!! I would rather not approve any of them for years to come than submissively do otherwise, simply for the sake of filling in the vacuum and only to be rapped and deceived again! I would rather spend years in failure from elections but eventually become successful in search of true honesty, true integrity and true representation of the people! P.S: 1. Raila was humbly requesting Ngilu to join ODM from the "snakes" just the other day in Kibera, and that is despite the fact that Ngilu had already demosntarted her true potential of betraying the people for her own selfish and corrupt ways in broad daylight which we all witnessed! Of course the Kibarans could only ululate and fiercely clap for their "Agwambo" in his courage of welcoming one of the dishonest cabinets back! 2. Juzi tu similar gesture was extended by Kalonzo to Ngilu and others at Ukambani, and akina Ndolo www.timesnews.co.ke/03apr06/nwsstory/topstry.html were doing the same to Kombo in Kibera in the company of Raila. Question: What is ODM and what do they really stand for? What principles do they bind themselves to which must not be breached? Who should be acceptable for ODM's leadership circle and who should not? Should ODM's membership just be a matter of declaration OR qualification as to committment of certain fundamental and honest ideals? What differentiates ODMs and others in terms of honesty and principles? What are we to choose which is good for ourselves and not simply remain as passive and naive idíots who do not have a clue as to what is happening around us? Why should we appear as if we have been hypnotised by these ever theiving and greedy politicians?Did I say we like to deceive ourselves? My dear brothers and sisters, lets us please have the courage and pray for wisdom that we may not repeat the mistakes of yesterday whilst fully awake!
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Post by ker7emmo on Apr 4, 2006 20:09:27 GMT 3
Fulani,if I smite you, will you be smitten with me and thus exalted?
PoliticalMaina, Seems to me your lunge at Kalonzo's bowels is misplaced. He has shown a lot of courage in standing up to Railla and the rest of the ODM franchise, seeking his own slice of the electorate and also in standing up to Moi and to Kibaki. I am not sure there is a lonelier politician in Kenya today,and the profession being as it is one of herds and packs,that must take some courage.
His appeal for amnesty for the Moi family is nothing new,indeed it is a refrain he has borrowed from your man of courage. That he made it at all is indicative only of his courting the old man's attention and not even the Rift Valley vote. It would take a fool to assume that Rift Valley folk would be more inclined to vote Kalonzo because he was seeking Moi's immunity from incarceration or harassment. No one in Kenya's political establishment is seeking that.
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Post by aeichener on Apr 4, 2006 21:04:29 GMT 3
Fulani,if I smite you, will you be smitten with me and thus exalted? Best pun of the year! Brilliant... ;D Alexander
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Post by johns on Apr 5, 2006 9:03:20 GMT 3
emmo,
I did not know that standing up to Reilla has become the standard by which kenyan politicians are measured. Are you trully serious when you claim that there is nothing wrong with Kalonzo giving a blanket amnesty to Mois past crimes should he become president? If that is your position then you have no business commenting on the ongoing window dressing investigations being spearheaded by RAV4. As i have indicated to you elsewhere; Reilas refrain or not does not qualify Mois pardon under any given circumstance. If Kalonzo finds it politicaly expedient to blut such a stupid promise to Moi then i wonder what he might have promised Kebaki when he made that secret visit to statehouse in the cover of darkness while seeking his cabinet potfolio back?
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Post by johns on Apr 5, 2006 9:06:44 GMT 3
Alex,
I suggest if you run out of ideas refrain from showing it here please. What is brilliant about saying nothing?
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Post by wanyee on Apr 5, 2006 22:09:13 GMT 3
Habari zenu? [This post is mostly ad-verbatim, its objective being primarily to inform]. I presently have a negative opinion of Mr. Musyoka, considering his previous performance as the Minister for Environment and Natural Resources. He replaced Dr. Newton Kulundu, while the government was fumbling with "Kenya's largest foreign investment venture to date" - the Kwale titanium-mining project (Ref: Canada And The Kenyan Titanium-Mining Scandal: A Classic Case Of Neocolonialism - www.agendaafrica.com/site/en/democracy.html). Just before the 2002 elections, President Kibaki promised the following, regarding this 10-year controversy... “NARC will…take measures to improve and sustain economic fundamentals…and an investment climate that will translate into rapid economic growth and employment opportunities for Kenyans. For every investment proposal, NARC will ask one fundamental question: How many jobs will it create?” [2002 Presidential Candidate Mwai Kibaki, in How Kenyans can get back on track (27th November 2002), . After the elections, MiningWatch Canada optimistically reported as follows... New Kenya Government Holds Tiomin To Account - www.miningwatch.ca/index.php?/Newsletter_12/New_Kenyan_GovernmenA fact-finding team, headed by Prof. Wangari Maathai, was sent to visit a titanium mine in South Africa, in order to ascertain the activity's effect on the environment. In a revealing interview, the East African Standard reported that “according to the plan, the delegation was to compile and present…findings to the government, and these were to form the basis for a decision on whether to license the company or not. The findings were to be discussed before a national consultative forum. But…just days after the trip, the government announced…that it had issued Tiomin with a mining permit. Curiously, the announcement came the same day a national forum had been organized to discuss the delegation’s findings. Everyone was taken aback, with most questioning the logic behind sending a high powered delegation to South Africa in the first place” [East Africa hails Wangari Maathai’s Peace Prize –East African Standard, 11th October 2004]. --- The present Minister for Environment is Mr. Kivutha Kibwana. Recent references of interest: Kenya is sitting on goldmine, says report - www.netafrika.com/home/article.php?aid=202 Kwale wants royalties for Tiomin mine - Sunday Nation, 2nd April 2006. Presently... "Kenyans are getting so little from the mining that it is going to be a rip-off…the slave labour will be provided by Kenyans…the Kenyan government should have been the one to invest in the production and processing of the minerals" [Nobel Laureate Professor Wangari Maathai, in Troubles Mount for Canadian Titanium Mine in Kenya – Environment News Service (www.ens-newswire.com)]. In view of the preceding, would it be unreasonable for us to expect Mr. Musyoka to have at least resigned honourably, having been fully aware that his country was getting such a raw deal? I also find it inexcusable, that NONE of his fellow M.P's, has challenged this blatant exploitation to date. --- p.s: Mzee Mombasa, bado tuko Ottawa. Tumeshika hawa wakoloni ngeta, na sasa hatutaki upuzi. Kumeumana! ------------------------------------------------------------------------ "The real ‘domino effect’ that terrified Western planners during the Cold War, was not the threat of Communist expansion, but the threat of nationalism. Were the poor to throw off the dictatorship of the West and better themselves in one part of the world, then people might be inspired to follow this ‘threat of a good example’” [David Cromwell, 2002; Private Planet: Corporate Plunder and the Fight Back, Jon Carpenter Publishing (Charlbury)].
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Post by Onyango Oloo on Apr 5, 2006 22:49:03 GMT 3
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