Minimal reforms pre 2007

[politicalmaniac]

I just feel the NACRK-ies and Baknistas are winning the propaganda war since their message is straight forward and needs no verbal massaging. I mean what is simpler that "why do LDP/ODM want minimum reforms? why not the whole dang document? Why go for half hearted change?" Their position is easier to enunciate.

Perhaps LDP/ODM should have thought of using different language to present their case to the public.

Any thoughts on the phraseology?

[kamalet]

That is what happens when political calls premised on dishonesty are made.

This was a call destined to fail since the proponents have a history of dishonesty and are known to drive matters to help personal interests!

I think this time, Kenyans saw through the lies in the scheme!

[politicalmaniac]

Well could it be that the minimal reforms call was a ploy?
Will the GOVT be said to "wamekata" reforms? "Hawataki" katiba mpya!

This in the end, will seems to be a negtive talking point against the GOVT in the long run!

[adongo12345]

ODM has given Kibaki a good long rope to hang himself with and he is doing a pretty good job at it.

If Kibaki and his perennial liars say they want "comprehensive reforms" of the constitution the next question is when? How about right now? And that is when the Kibakites fall silent. They know they can't deliver the constitution before the General Elections. And they also know telling Kenyans they will deliver one after the elections will remind Kenyans of the 100 day promise which really annoys Kenyans who feel completely duped by Kibaki.

And Kamale: Get real sometimes. It wont kill you. What do you mean with this pathetic statement.

"This was a call destined to fail since the proponents have a history of dishonesty and are known to drive matters to help personal interests!

I think this time, Kenyans saw through the lies in the scheme!"

When did the Kenyans tell you about the lies? Why do you think Kombo is shifting back to support the minimum reform agenda.

Local Government minister Musikari Kombo (l), who is also Ford Kenya chairman, accompanied by Shinyalu MP Daniel Khamasi leave the venue of a press conference at Parliament Buildings where they backed calls for minimum reforms before elections

Kombo knows things are very different on the ground. Kombo would never want to piss off his boss but he knows his own political future is on the line.

The ODM has put Kibaki in a pretty bad situation. The only thing they have to do is tell Kibaki: If you don't want minimum reforms then lets have those comprehensive reforms now. What are we waiting for? And then what?

Like I said elsewhere, the constitutional agenda is not one of Kibaki's strong points. Having it front and centre as we approach the elections is simply bad news for Kibaki.

Adongo

I forgot one more thing. From what we have seen so far, the ODM camp is pretty compact. They are speaking with one voice and even the shaky characters like Kosgey and other Kanu types whom Kibaki want to lure into the government with ministerial appointments have spoken very forcefully about their support for the reform agenda.

On Kibaki's side things are actually falling apart. Kombo is just one case. Other than the usual suspects like the leadership of the Catholic Church and disgraced faith leaders like Mutava the Kibaki support group is essentially the failed banana republicans. Muite has jumped ship and we are only at the start. There are many bananiacs who don't want to stick with the losers one more time. This is not good for Kibaki.

I really question the competence of Kibaki's advisors. The idea of Kibaki jumping into the argument with his patented Wapumbavu speech was ill advised.

This is what the old man said.

"Mlipigana makofi wakati huo ati hamutaki… haiyayaya. Constitution hapana kitu ya mchezo. Sisi sio wapumbavu au watoto. (You fought to reject it that time. A constitution is not a joke. We are neither stupid nor children)," Kibaki told ODM.

"Baada ya kuregarega huko, sasa unasema unaitaka haraka. Kwani hukuwa na haraka mwaka uliopita?"



Kibaki should have been advised to call a round table meeting with ODM, other political groups, faith groups, representatives from the human rights sector. Such a meeting could be just to waste time pretend he is doing something and get a feeling of what is going on. By jumping into the debate and talking nonsense Kibaki has opened himself up for a lot of attacks.

[kamalet]

If Kibaki and his perennial liars say they want "comprehensive reforms" of the constitution the next question is when? How about right now? And that is when the Kibakites fall silent. They know they can't deliver the constitution before the General Elections. And they also know telling Kenyans they will deliver one after the elections will remind Kenyans of the 100 day promise which really annoys Kenyans who feel completely duped by Kibaki.

And Kamale: Get real sometimes. It wont kill you. What do you mean with this pathetic statement.

"This was a call destined to fail since the proponents have a history of dishonesty and are known to drive matters to help personal interests!

I think this time, Kenyans saw through the lies in the scheme!"

When did the Kenyans tell you about the lies? Why do you think Kombo is shifting back to support the minimum reform agenda.

Case of a kettle calling the pot black?

So who told you Kenyans feel duped by Kibaki? I think this a rather lame way of advancing and argument Adongo.

[roughrider]

Summarizing and Restating the case for Fairness Reforms

1. It is now crystal clear that a comprehensive constitutional review cannot be achieved before the next general elections because we have neither time nor resources. In addition there is no legislative framework in place to guide the process.

2. The mandate for chaperoning a fresh and acceptable constitution is therefore that of the next government and the 10th parliament.

3. In order to get a comprehensive constitutional review we need to elect a government and a parliament that has the political will, intellectual and social capacity to allow far reaching reforms.

4. In order to elect a government that will allow far reaching reforms we need to assure of free and fair general elections in 2007; the elections of 2007 must by all and any means necessary reflect the sovereign will of the Kenyan people.

5. The last elections in 2002 were deemed to be largely free and fair under the current constitution and the informal IPPG arrangement mainly because former President Moi allowed them to be so. President Kibaki, at the last referendum and during the recent by-elections has shown that he will not be equally magnanimous, and will use state power and resources to tilt the balance. This is unacceptable.

6. In order to assure free and fair elections in 2007 – and therefore secure the promise of greater, deeper, wider, far-reaching and radical reform – we need to implement fairness reforms.

7. Like good farmers, Kenyans will, by allowing some reforms today, be clearing the land for the ploughing tractors of greater reform.

8. The decisions on ‘when’, ‘how’, ‘why’, ‘what’ and ‘how much’ vis-à-vis constitutional change is fundamentally and essentially that of the Kenyan people collectively. It is not that of the president, cabinet, churches, political parties and other interests groups. They may lobby and cajole the people as is the tried and tested democratic practice but they may not ‘rule out’ or engage in brinkmanship with the people.

[job]

Roughrider,

Well summarized.

In some post here, someone mentioned the words, "dishonesty", "driving matters to help personal interests" and "lies".

Many politicians could be aptly described well by those words but none fits this bill more than the lazy fencesitter. Those words fit directly into the personal profile of the man heading Kenya today, Emilio Mwai Kibaki; a man who is -dishonest- and -lies- about (of all things) his family composition. A man who denies his own blood -to help advance his personal interests-.

A man who has disowned his family (poor Wambui and Wangui), friends, political allies, the electorate,...all for -his own personal interests-.

Who else, without batting an eyelid, -lies- about :
having one wife when he has two;.... having four children when he has five; .... running for office for only one term when he means two; ...... acceeding to a new constitution in 100 days when he means "not happening under me" ; .... sharing power with coalition partners when he means " not happening" ;...... ending tribalism in Kenya when he means "that's exactly my hallmark" ; ......ending roadside declarations when he means " where else will I dish out districts" ; ....... banning his portrait from currencies & public offices when he means " pumbavus must be joking" ; .....and having zero tolerance to corruption when he actually means " you will be Anglo-fleeced to bones".

I just wonder who is the kettle and who's the pot here.

Whether Kenyans want reforms or not is up to them (the people). It is them that have witnessed and made judgement as to whether our governance system is good or bad, ......as to whether corruption is destroying the country or not, ........as to whether public resources are being wasted in elections or not,........ as to whether the ECK is independent or not,...... etc etc.

The issue of WHEN they want them (now or later) is also up to them. But the silent dictator, Kibaki and the Catholics have already "decided" for Kenyans and said NO!..... not now. This could directly be extrapolated to mean, "no changes under my watch" or "I need the excessive executive powers guaranteed by the current constitution fully intact- there's still some business to finish".

This is where the -dishonesty- of Kibaki coupled with his -lies- and push for his - personal interests- ARE CONFLICTING WITH THE INTERESTS OF MAJORITY OF KENYANS. People must not be fooled by his spin propaganda of shifting blame to others.

It is ONLY Kibaki who is the current PRESIDENT, and under his watch Kenyans have witnessed for themselves in broad daylight; massive looting, nepotism, dangerous tribalism, ineptitude, electoral fraud and rigging, plunder of state and public resources...... etc. The people have their own way of answering back. It is soon coming.

unedited.
Job

[adongo12345]

Well said RR.

I have nothing to add.

[dubois]

The Kibaki government certainly lacks credibility when it comes to the constitution making process. However the recent calls for minimum constitutional reforms are over the top.

Firstly, no matter what ODM pulls it is unlikely Kibaki will bend on this one (he is actually not a moderate at all). I believe Kibaki would rather be sacked by the Kenyan public next year rather than cede to ODM demands. Raila, the master strategist, is probably aware of this fact. He is also aware that such a debate will bitterly polarize the country back to the pre-referendum level. So far there is already a replay of the orange vs banana or to put it bluntly the rest of Kenya vs the kikuyu. ODM is well aware that their best chance of getting elected is a volatile and divided population.

Secondly the ODM has cunningly pulled the rug off Kibaki's feet. Just when Kibaki seemed to be recovering from a series of blunders they have revived his nightmares. Whether their strategy will work this time round is another question altogether. I believe the retired president, Moi, might be the crucial key to decide the ultimate victor. It is important to remember that the recent calls have nothing to do with a free and fair election (as if it is possible even in the most advanced democracies) in 2007. After all, Kanu was swept out of power in 2002 despite a bad constitution, massive rigging and abuse of government resources. If Kibaki is as unpopular as some say he is, reforms or no reforms, he will be swept out next year. In other words the constitution debate is a cunning but vicious strategy to deny Kibaki any chance of a comeback.

Finally I must express utmost disgust at some fellows in Kenyan circles and even here in Jukwaa who go under the banner of 'apolitical observers'. You have to be pretty naive or a hypocrite not to read the political calculations of this debate. Furthermore, these same fellows are writing thousands of words justifying the need for minimum reforms as a wider plot to achieve comprehensive reforms. To these fellows I say; If you are the moral voice of the oppressed citizens then Kenyans do not need any enemies. You are no better than our politicians who scavenge on poor men, women and children for their survival.

Justice doesn't come in measured quantities. It's got to be present or it's not enough.

[dubois]

Kenyan politicians are not known to keep their agenda secret. The article below confirms the power intrigues behind the recent constitution debate.

www.nationmedia.com/dailynation/nmgcontententry.asp?category_id=2&newsid=79547

reply to roughrider's points:

1. I absolutely agree with you on your first two points. It is very unlikely our political leaders on both sides can come together and oversee a comprehensive constitution in less than 16 months not to mention the resources etcetera.

2. I have to disagree with the insinuations on the rest of your points. Like I mentioned earlier, Kibaki's government clearly lacks credibility in the constitution making process. However I disagree with your suggestion that Kenyans should leave this responsibility to the next government and this is why:

Firstly, there is no doubt that we urgently need a constitution that will guarantee free and fair elections, trim executive powers and empower the ECK. However, we also urgently need a constitution that will address our civil liberties, devolution, land distribution and a host of other factors that touch on the ordinary citizen. I refuse to be deceived that any of the above issues is more urgent than the other, which brings me to my second point.

If any Kenyan is to buy the calls for minimum reforms they will be left at the mercy of politicians once again. The minimum reforms are mainly targeting the 2007 elections and the executive. In essence what you are trying to convince Kenyans is that once Kibaki is beaten in a free and fair election, ODM or the party that wins will urgently embark on a comprehensive constitution. This is too much to ask Sir, I (and i believe I'm not alone) do not share your faith in any political group. Furthermore isn't history repeating itself? Didn't Narc promise to deliver a constitution in 100 days? No, wait a minute- Kibaki is the problem- right? So was Moi. If ODM feels slighted that they do not have a level playing ground during elections, picture what the ordinary citizen feels like everyday living under an exploitative and unjust constitution.

Finally the push for minimum reforms is not people driven as some are suggesting. As far as I know, the ordinary citizen is still waiting for a constitution that will finally offer a chance for justice and prosperity for all. This my friend will not be achieved by minimum reforms. The next government is likely to meet many hurdles in creating a comprehensive constitution. Ultimately, dialog and reconciliation, across all parties, are the only key factors that will determine whether we get a new constitution. A government in waiting can promise the moon but we should know better. Are we too foolish to realize that minimum reforms satisfies only opposition politicians? How can we hold the post 2007 government to their promises? Will we be back here writing bitter essays and promising a tsunami in 2012? For those who are genuinely naive, don't be fooled, politics is a very dirty business. But for those who consciously and deliberately mislead Kenyans, SHAME ON YOU!

[mossad]

Not having a new constitution can not be blamed on anybody else except kibaki.
This man has proven over and over again that he's incapable of achieving anything meaningful for the pple of kenya. Thank God 2007 is just at the coner coz i'd rather vote for a dog than this skunk.

Mossad.

[Deleted]

hey Mossad
that was funny. after I saw the carton in today's Standard then your skunk comments I was cracking up.

yep!

thanks!

[roughrider]

Job,

I will say this; if all Kenyans could be as conscientious and patriotic as you are then perhaps this country would be the place we only dream it could be… but perhaps even more important and admirable is your memory; Kenyans have generally short memory and it helps to remember what leaders have promised and characterize them appropriately.

Dubois

Re your first response:

You choose to make a political and street-smart interpretation of the ODM-led quest for fairness constitutional change before 2007 – that it is all merely a matter of political strategy meant to outwit and defeat Mwai Kibaki? My view is that the minimal reforms campaign is a case of what is right, just and popular coinciding with smart ‘political strategy’… and why not? The best political strategy is always doing what is right by the people!

Re your second response:

First, it is fallacy and even diabolical to purport to separate various reforms as ‘people’ and others as not. Electoral and reforms aimed at decongesting the executive are as important to the people as the ones on devolution, human rights and whatnot. Minimum reforms are only a question of prioritizing. Perhaps you need a reminder that the quest for minimum constitutional reform is not incompatible with comprehensive reforms. Indeed it is my contention that fairness reforms today will preserve the promise of full reforms tomorrow.

Secondly you have launched an incongruous assault on the concept of democracy as we know and practice it. Unlike you, Dubois, we do not believe that politicians are all the same – Mbeki is not Mandela and Mandela is not Botha. Otherwise what would be the point of elections or democracy? To a certain degree there is a diverse pool of leaders to choose from; whatever the shape of the reform movement in future, parliament and government will play a crucial role. If elections are free and fair Kenyans will make their wishes known by electing the leaders they think will deliver…. don’t take that right away from us!

Lastly, we should not try to argue in a vacuum. There is evidence of growing intolerance to pluralism and the concerted efforts to create a new monolithic government party could be part of this effort. Some people have alleged that resource allocation has taken a decidedly partisan and ethnic bent. The IPPG that served to create a semblance of fairness in the last two elections was a gentleman’s agreement that has since lapsed. Even as we argue for comprehensive reform we must guard against possible backsliding.

[dubois]

Well thought commentaries,

www.nationmedia.com/dailynation/nmgcontententry.asp?category_id=25&newsid=79808

www.nationmedia.com/dailynation/nmgcontententry.asp?category_id=25&newsid=79806

[politicalmaniac]

R began the walk out of Moi's KANU, ditto
R began the call to denounce and reject the Wako dmongrel, ditto
R's began the call for electoral reform, ?


Are we seeing a shift? I mean are the NARKies and Baknistas budging a little bit, paving the way for electoral reform, leveling out the playing field for real? for the first time in Kenyan history?

If this REALLY occurs, and even if kickbakc1 looses, he will, despite a wasted 5yrs, leave democracy marching in the right direction.

I will reserve judgement untll the reforms occur. For real.