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Post by Titchaz on Sept 27, 2011 4:33:12 GMT 3
Wakuu wa Jukwaa, I don't know how to approach this matter but I must say I'm appalled when men (Kenyan in this case) die without living a will to iron out differences that arise after the fact. Yaani kuandika will imekua shida namna gani bana? Sasa katika huu mfano, a whole Bishop moves on living behind 2 wives... yes 2 wives...with kids to boot!!! Sasa kila mtu anataka apewe pande. What left me wondering is when one of the daughters comes up saying sijui "we want to know how our father got married to another woman when he was still legally married to my mother:... surely???....yaani where have you been all these days to voice your concerns?...Are those concerns genuine?...Really? Kisha that other Kalulu sitting on the dead man's grave eti tryna make a statement...surely? Kweli Kenya kuna vituko....chambelecho kakangu... "Kenya tulirogwa kitambo na aliyeturoga keshakufa!!!"Watch the video... |
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Post by tnk on Sept 27, 2011 6:34:00 GMT 3
Wakuu wa Jukwaa, I don't know how to approach this matter but I must say I'm appalled when men (Kenyan in this case) die without living a will to iron out differences that arise after the fact. Yaani kuandika will imekua shida namna gani bana? Sasa katika huu mfano, a whole Bishop moves on living behind 2 wives... yes 2 wives...with kids to boot!!! Sasa kila mtu anataka apewe pande. What left me wondering is when one of the daughters comes up saying sijui "we want to know how our father got married to another woman when he was still legally married to my mother:... surely???....yaani where have you been all these days to voice your concerns?...Are those concerns genuine?...Really? Kisha that other Kalulu sitting on the dead man's grave eti tryna make a statement...surely? Kweli Kenya kuna vituko....chambelecho kakangu... "Kenya tulirogwa kitambo na aliyeturoga keshakufa!!!"Watch the video... lots more emotion and pain can be found here |
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Post by destiny on Sept 27, 2011 9:15:03 GMT 3
Kenyan men need to style up?
Why tar all Kenyan men with the same brush just because of one pinhead bishop?
Isn't this "sexist" then Bwana Oloo?
Ok Mwana wa Kisauni, prepare to be suspended for 3 months! ;D
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Post by Onyango Oloo on Sept 27, 2011 13:36:00 GMT 3
Kenyan men need to style up?Why tar all Kenyan men with the same brush just because of one pinhead bishop? Isn't this "sexist" then Bwana Oloo? Ok Mwana wa Kisauni, prepare to be suspended for 3 months! ;D Is it your "destiny" kunitafuta na uchokozi?On a separate note, are you the same "Destiny" from Kenya Talk, circa 2001-2003? Onyango Oloo |
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Post by destiny on Sept 27, 2011 15:46:50 GMT 3
Bwana Oloo apana sikutafuti. I think I was trying to crack a joke which seems to have backfired badly on my face. Ama perhaps it feels good when a minnow like me takes on a giant like double OO..hehehe!
I'm not that destiny you are talking about although I recall her pretty well with the likes of Njamlik, Terminator and others. I was a member of that forum those many years back and I'm currently registered in a few. But nothing comes close to Jukwaa and I say that with my hand firmly on my chest.
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Post by Titchaz on Sept 27, 2011 18:50:39 GMT 3
Kenyan men need to style up?Why tar all Kenyan men with the same brush just because of one pinhead bishop? Isn't this "sexist" then Bwana Oloo? Ok Mwana wa Kisauni, prepare to be suspended for 3 months! ;D heshima kwako natanguliza dadangu. I'm not trying to paint Kenyan men with the same brush lakini kuna msemo flani wa kimombo..."If it walks like a duck, smells like a duck and acts like a duck, then definitely it is a duck." Now to the issue at hand, how many Kenyan men do you know who have living wills so to speak? This issue is dear to me maana when our old man moved on to the by and by, he left us in the same predicament. I'm not ashamed to say that the man was also polygamous with a clan in tow!!! During his funeral wazee wa kaya walikuja na hadithi ndefu kuhusu mila na desturi na jinsi yu kugawa posho. As a family we had to take a step back and figure out what was best for us and what those wazees were saying. We came together as kids and decided not to balkanize any of the assets he left behind. If anything all the resources were pulled together and folks were assisted on a need basis. Hii mambo ya kugawana mali is the source of all these quarrels na kukatana mapanga. Kisha flashback kidogo and look at these two prominent examples we had to deal with in the media.... Did that rich guy of River Road (Gerishom Kirima) live any will behind ama we were left to see soap operas in the media...with the president himself being dragged in.Wanjiru the athlete naye ilikuaje?...we saw women fighting for his earthly possessions with 'surrorogate fathers' appearing out of the woodworks....nasikia pia Mbiyu Koinange ni hivyo tu. That can be replicated across the whole width and breadth of the country. Hata humu Jukwaa kuna watu wangapi wanajadili hili swala kwa undani? People are even scared of discussing death, now how are they gonna discuss living wills?...In their folly wanaona mkianza kujadili hizi ishu ni kama kumtakia jamaa afe...arrghhhh!!! Kwa hivyo changamoto yangu hapa ni kuwahamasisha wanaume wa Jamhuri ya Kenya walitizame hili swala kwa upeo unaotakikana. This business of the river finding its level is archaic. WANAUME HEBU CHORENI 'WILLS' KABLA HAMJAKUFA!!!!  Nawasilisha. |
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Post by marikopolitico on Sept 27, 2011 20:09:26 GMT 3
I doubt it if drafting a will would completely halt all succession disputes like the one we are seeing with the Bishop Gaitho family.
GREED and not last testaments are the single underlying cause of almost all succession battles.
As long as a testator leaves dissatisfied dependants there will always be a courtroom battle for lawyers and the media to enjoy.
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Post by joblesscorner on Sept 28, 2011 2:01:48 GMT 3
I doubt it if drafting a will would completely halt all succession disputes like the one we are seeing with the Bishop Gaitho family. GREED and not last testaments are the single underlying cause of almost all succession battles. As long as a testator leaves dissatisfied dependants there will always be a courtroom battle for lawyers and the media to enjoy. True!!!!! It's greed, sometimes it's not that much of money that they are fight for, but surely( as the ready say's it.... ;D ;D ;D ;D) Bishop Gaitho had to wives and he didnt know himself, Quite intriguing for me....  |
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Post by kasuku on Sept 28, 2011 9:41:24 GMT 3
I agree the Testament isn’t the solution here; the wise solution would be to distribute the wealth in his life time if he has more than one Family.
I will go farther and predict that some of these men are twisted and run their families like dictators. He enjoys to see them slaving out for him and kissing the path he walks on competing in pleasing him. I will even go father to predict that he leaves the uncertainty of his wealth contribution to his family for them to fight for it.
As soon as he dies, the chaos is programmed. Everyone in the Family shouts louder than the other for their rightfulness for that wealth they have crawled on the floor working hard to be the old man’s main Heritance and go mad all at once just like we see in these Video and others and they are left with nothing to prove that they worn.
People who haven’t worked hard to earn their money legitimately have no respect for it. They will protect it even in the beyond, in their grave and the whole Family is cursed from there on till eternity or some many generations later one undoes the curse.
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mrembo
Full Member
Jaber
Posts: 136
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Post by mrembo on Sept 29, 2011 21:44:36 GMT 3
I doubt it if drafting a will would completely halt all succession disputes like the one we are seeing with the Bishop Gaitho family. GREED and not last testaments are the single underlying cause of almost all succession battles.As long as a testator leaves dissatisfied dependants there will always be a courtroom battle for lawyers and the media to enjoy. I guess its like asking why we don't hear of disputes in poor families. |
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Post by subsaharanite on Oct 4, 2011 2:06:02 GMT 3
You are all wrong, Kenyan women need to step up. They should not look upon men for their survival. This idea that a man should be the provider is as old as the humanity, but we all know that times have changed. These same women speak of equality. They should work hard and make sure that they contribute equally so that in case the man passes, they wont have to suffer.
I have discovered that the work purportedly women do (housework) is very simple and can be done by men too and its actually very simple. I have actually done it. The only real work that we cannot do is carry a pregnancy. Women should have sound investments on their own just like their men do for cautionary purposes. Just like we should not look into inheritance as our right, women should certainly re-engineer themselves upon lose of a loved ones to take over the family and continue generating revenue for all rather than fighting over a few coins that the men worked hard to obtain. Wake up girls!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2011 8:34:28 GMT 3
You are all wrong, Kenyan women need to step up. They should not look upon men for their survival. This idea that a man should be the provider is as old as the humanity, but we all know that times have changed. These same women speak of equality. They should work hard and make sure that they contribute equally so that in case the man passes, they wont have to suffer. I have discovered that the work purportedly women do (housework) is very simple and can be done by men too and its actually very simple. I have actually done it. The only real work that we cannot do is carry a pregnancy. Women should have sound investments on their own just like their men do for cautionary purposes. Just like we should not look into inheritance as our right, women should certainly re-engineer themselves upon lose of a loved ones to take over the family and continue generating revenue for all rather than fighting over a few coins that the men worked hard to obtain. Wake up girls! AND You are not deserving of your handle. You belong in space or somewhere else other than Africa south of the Sahara. There are many others who belong there with you so you'll have lots of company. AND Your post above is bait that nobody is falling for, well unless.... You want to rope people into wasting their energies with rebuttals to the dribble. Why must you waste our time? |
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Post by subsaharanite on Oct 10, 2011 2:23:23 GMT 3
Kathureke
The culture of over-dependence of one individual in Africa has grown beyond reprieve to an extent where one would kill another in order to gain the little that was left by a dead bread winner. This is well documented and illustrated in numerous incidents that happen every now and again in the Kenyan society, Further, there is an even bizarre twist, mothers, sons and daughters gang up against poor fathers who have worked tirelessly to generate wealth, hack them to death and get hold of perhaps land and literary eat it. Some brothers kill their own brothers just to increase their share of inheritance. Why does this happen? - the perpetrators in most cases cannot see beyond the dead man's wealth.
We have seen previously clandestine families arise after the death of their provider to lay claim in 'their estate' resulting in fights and even more deaths. You are aware of the Kirima fiasco, already one family member has died 'accidentally'. Kirima probably died due to shock of the events that were happening around him.
Kuthureke, we both know that these happens as a result of over- dependency of one breadwinner. If a man had a clandestine relationship, had an extra family, traditionally this family has been accorded its fair share of the dead man's wealth. They are brought to the open, vetted and if found to belong to the dead man, they are enjoined with the 'known' family. I have seen this happen a million times amongst my community. Nowdays one greedy family side will want to use whatever means they have to disinherit the other just because they cannot see beyond the dead man's hard work. We have see numerous families transform from riches to rags simply because they misused their late bread winner's wealth.
We have actually seen people kill old rich family members just to get their wealth which is often mismanaged and wasted soon after.
What is the solution? Should we encourage more women to depend on their late husband's inheritance? Could it be better if they re-engineered themselves into providers and wealth generators rather than net consumers? What happens after the inheritance runs out? Are clandestine family members not entitled to a share of their dead father? What should happen to them? Can blaming a dead man for not distributing his wealth while alive solve the problem?
Kathureke, the least a woman can do upon death of his spouse to maintain his legacy, or better still his good side. If she cannot be entrepreneurial like her late provider, then its likely the entire family will go down. If she cannot look for a long term solution to sustain the dead man's family, then they too will join him. If all she sees is the little that he left in the bank, then the family again goes down. If all she has to do is fight and decimate the 'other family', then she is not even worth marrying in the first place. If saying this angers you, then kick me out.
Now come to housework, anyman who has lived in the west and has had an opportunity to have a family has probably handled housework. They have had to raise their kids or take care of their needs at one time or another. Is it doable? Yes. Is it hard, yes probably the first few days but once you are in it, its all about organization. You soon discover that you can actually handle it even better than a woman can. Have I done it? Yes and I enjoyed it. It was simple, and I enjoyed the company I had with my kids.
The bottom line is that the death of a provider should not signify the beginning of chaos. Those left within the family should step into his shoes and continue supporting the family, just like he did. If the woman cannot do this but is willing in engaging is sideshows that include court cases that are geared towards disinheriting other possible larger family members, she will end up destroying her immediate family too.
Just because a man's mischievously adventures resulted in the ballooning of the family size does not imply that they do not deserve help. They too are at loss of their source of in come.
The man may have been wrong, but they maybe victims too. I am sure some people herein belong to the 'other family' and certainly will agree with me.
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Post by kamalet on Oct 10, 2011 9:55:34 GMT 3
You are all wrong, Kenyan women need to step up. They should not look upon men for their survival. This idea that a man should be the provider is as old as the humanity, but we all know that times have changed. These same women speak of equality. They should work hard and make sure that they contribute equally so that in case the man passes, they wont have to suffer. I have discovered that the work purportedly women do (housework) is very simple and can be done by men too and its actually very simple. I have actually done it. The only real work that we cannot do is carry a pregnancy. Women should have sound investments on their own just like their men do for cautionary purposes. Just like we should not look into inheritance as our right, women should certainly re-engineer themselves upon lose of a loved ones to take over the family and continue generating revenue for all rather than fighting over a few coins that the men worked hard to obtain. Wake up girls! AND You are not deserving of your handle. You belong in space or somewhere else other than Africa south of the Sahara. There are many others who belong there with you so you'll have lots of company. AND Your post above is bait that nobody is falling for, well unless.... You want to rope people into wasting their energies with rebuttals to the dribble. Why must you waste our time?This is potential abuse and misuse of moderator powers. The post by Subsaharanite is not even remotely sexist if that is the reason for the notice...unless of course this moderator did not read what had been written! |
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Post by commes on Oct 10, 2011 12:25:04 GMT 3
Sexism illustrated courtesy Daily Nation |
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Post by kasuku on Oct 10, 2011 13:50:50 GMT 3
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Post by roughrider on Oct 10, 2011 15:18:11 GMT 3
Here is a 5. point prescription that will invariably work to preserve the African family. This plan is FOOLPROOF. Common, go ahead and try it!
1. Every woman should be married to one man and every man to one woman. No exceptions. Children will come as blessings to that couple.
2. Wives should submit to their husbands in love.
3. Husbands should love their wives totally, unconditionally and unreservedly
4. Children must obey and honor their parents at all times.
5. Parents must nurture their children and show them the right path, and when they are adults, they will not depart from it.
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