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Post by job on Dec 6, 2011 19:49:46 GMT 3
What in the World? Mr Kioni is said to be working with a group of MPs from central Kenya to develop the constitutional amendments to scrap the Senate. The Ndaragwa MP argues that Senators have no clear mandate under the new Constitution and that their role, if any, can easily be undertaken by Parliament.
He also argues that the establishment of the Senate will place a huge burden on the taxpayer who is already grappling with the high cost of living. “The Senate is part of an extravagant governance structure which is very expensive,” Mr Kioni argues in the proposed constitutional amendment [/color][/i][/blockquote] www.nation.co.ke/News/politics/Kenneth+criticises+proposal+to+abolish+Senate/-/1064/1285002/-/rx48uhz/-/index.htmlEvery Tom, Dick and Harry knows the paramount role of the Senate; especially in protecting Counties, minorities, and marginalized areas. That is precisely why it was entrenched in the Constitution in the first place - a Constitution that was ratified by about 70% of Kenyans. The coalition of Watermelons and NO proponents (aka KKK or G-7) is now rearing its head again! Constitutional Reform in Kenya has been a major issue since independence. Today as Boss Uhuru Kenyatta’s foot-soldier and KKK/G-7 advocate Jeremiah Kioni leads an assault to abolish the Senate, it’s important to revisit the history of Constitutional Amendments (mutilations) and see it repeating itself: • 1963 - Kenya gains independence and adopts a multi-party parliamentary system where Jomo Kenyatta was installed Kenya's first Prime Minister.
Constitution provides a parliamentary system, and 8 Federal Assemblies (Majimbos) devolved at provincial level and a Senate.
• 1964 Constitution Amendment - Kenya abolishes the parliamentary system and Prime Minister position and adopts a pure Presidential system.
Without an election Jomo Kenyatta installs himself (technically) as Kenya's first President.
• 1966 Constitution Amendment – After starving Federal Jimbos of funding since independence, Jomo Kenyatta and allies now scrap the Federal assemblies at provincial level. Devolution is officially dead.
• 1966 Constitution Amendment – Kenyatta and allies dissolve the Senate and its members absorbed into the National Assembly. Minority and marginalized area protection is officially dead.
• 1976 Constitutional Amendment – enables the President to pardon politicians barred from contesting elections over electoral malpractices. Opposition to amendment the leads to the arrest and imprisonment of Philomena Chelagat Mutai and George Anyona.
• 1983 Constitution Amendment – Abolishes Multi-partism making Kenya a single party state with KANU as the ruling party. This was followed by the mlolongo system where secret-ballots were no longer used. State Repression, Police Brutality, and Unlawful Detentions become the order of the day. Ain’t we being taken by these KKK/G-7 fellas through a whirlwind of a freakin’ circle! Gud lawd! Who's gonna wait for the terrible outcome we've already experienced?
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Post by adongo23456 on Dec 6, 2011 20:12:54 GMT 3
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Post by phil on Dec 6, 2011 21:05:24 GMT 3
thank God for small mercies.
that chapter requires a REFERENDUM to see light of day!
You can buy MPs all the time, but you can hardly buy the people at anytime.
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Post by Omwenga on Dec 6, 2011 21:31:53 GMT 3
job, These clowns are going nowhere. This is a dead idea. Where do they cook up such nonsense? @adongo, We are here in the US witnessing one clown by the name Donald the Dumb Trump payukaring time after time about things you wonder whether he thinks at all but sadly enough, there are enough dumber folks who think he is brilliant in the nonsense he spews from his mouth, including his continued persistence that he does not believe Obama was born in the US and never mind he (Obama) produced the "Long Form" birth certificate the Dumb Trump demanded he produce to prove he was born in the US. When Obama did this, the Dump Trump took a low profile without even as apologizing and has now re-emerged with the same nonsense which is simply laughable as should this Kioni and the rest of the clowns advising G7 on this dimwitted idea. |
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Post by njugunajohn on Dec 7, 2011 12:46:34 GMT 3
What in the World? Mr Kioni is said to be working with a group of MPs from central Kenya to develop the constitutional amendments to scrap the Senate. The Ndaragwa MP argues that Senators have no clear mandate under the new Constitution and that their role, if any, can easily be undertaken by Parliament.
He also argues that the establishment of the Senate will place a huge burden on the taxpayer who is already grappling with the high cost of living. “The Senate is part of an extravagant governance structure which is very expensive,” Mr Kioni argues in the proposed constitutional amendment [/color][/i][/blockquote] www.nation.co.ke/News/politics/Kenneth+criticises+proposal+to+abolish+Senate/-/1064/1285002/-/rx48uhz/-/index.htmlEvery Tom, Dick and Harry knows the paramount role of the Senate; especially in protecting Counties, minorities, and marginalized areas. That is precisely why it was entrenched in the Constitution in the first place - a Constitution that was ratified by about 70% of Kenyans. The coalition of Watermelons and NO proponents (aka KKK or G-7) is now rearing its head again! Constitutional Reform in Kenya has been a major issue since independence. Today as Boss Uhuru Kenyatta’s foot-soldier and KKK/G-7 advocate Jeremiah Kioni leads an assault to abolish the Senate, it’s important to revisit the history of Constitutional Amendments (mutilations) and see it repeating itself: • 1963 - Kenya gains independence and adopts a multi-party parliamentary system where Jomo Kenyatta was installed Kenya's first Prime Minister.
Constitution provides a parliamentary system, and 8 Federal Assemblies (Majimbos) devolved at provincial level and a Senate.
• 1964 Constitution Amendment - Kenya abolishes the parliamentary system and Prime Minister position and adopts a pure Presidential system.
Without an election Jomo Kenyatta installs himself (technically) as Kenya's first President.
• 1966 Constitution Amendment – After starving Federal Jimbos of funding since independence, Jomo Kenyatta and allies now scrap the Federal assemblies at provincial level. Devolution is officially dead.
• 1966 Constitution Amendment – Kenyatta and allies dissolve the Senate and its members absorbed into the National Assembly. Minority and marginalized area protection is officially dead.
• 1976 Constitutional Amendment – enables the President to pardon politicians barred from contesting elections over electoral malpractices. Opposition to amendment the leads to the arrest and imprisonment of Philomena Chelagat Mutai and George Anyona.
• 1983 Constitution Amendment – Abolishes Multi-partism making Kenya a single party state with KANU as the ruling party. This was followed by the mlolongo system where secret-ballots were no longer used. State Repression, Police Brutality, and Unlawful Detentions become the order of the day. Ain’t we being taken by these KKK/G-7 fellas through a whirlwind of a freakin’ circle! Gud lawd! Who's gonna wait for the terrible outcome we've already experienced? [/quote] You are peddling lies! Deputy Prime Minister and Finance Minister, Uhuru Kenyatta, speaking through his spokesman Munyori Buku, dismissed the planned amendment saying (Star of 6th December, 2011): “This is unnecessary and takes us backwards and not forward. This is the time to implement the Constitution that Kenya spent decades fighting for…" If you had cared to read the Star before writing these lies you would have had the decency of aborting your hateful rant against the G7 and for your information calling the G7 KKK will soon be a criminal offence if Mzalendo Kibunja heeds Kalonzo's warning to take action against the likes of you. |
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Post by kamalet on Dec 7, 2011 14:24:27 GMT 3
It is strange how an silly statement that is not even possible to act upon gets too many people to react! If we are ever angry whenever anyone decides to issue a stupid statement b reacting in anger, we shall be a very angry society!
Kion and his unnamed colleagues only wanted to make noise!
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Post by job on Dec 7, 2011 17:44:24 GMT 3
You are peddling lies!
Deputy Prime Minister and Finance Minister, Uhuru Kenyatta, speaking through his spokesman Munyori Buku, dismissed the planned amendment saying (Star of 6th December, 2011): “This is unnecessary and takes us backwards and not forward. This is the time to implement the Constitution that Kenya spent decades fighting for…"
If you had cared to read the Star before writing these lies you would have had the decency of aborting your hateful rant against the G7 “When power gets to our heads, we start playing good cards above the table and dangerous cards under the table”
Former Vice President of the Republic of Kenya, the late Michael Kijana Wamalwa Is there a speaking-from-both-sides-of-the-mouth precedent from Boss Uhuru Kenyatta? Someone who knows him well thinks so! “Uhuru Kenyatta’s policy swung between covertly soliciting Mungiki’s support at night and publicly distancing his campaign from its activities during the day”.
Prof. Peter Kagwanja Ph.D., Director and Founder, Africa Policy Institute (API); Party of National Unity (PNU) Strategist and Policy spokesman. Criminalizing speech and acronyms coined by none other than Kalonzo Musyoka himself is silly to say the least. Quite a laughable and futile attempt. The so called G-7 has been, still is, and will likely remain the same KKK tri-tribal formation dreamt in the minds of ethnic exclusionists like Kalonzo Musyoka et al. It is what it is...irrespective of Kibunja's self-conflicted bias. Toa hiyo; leta ingine! |
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Post by mwalimumkuu on Dec 7, 2011 17:50:53 GMT 3
My friend, you seem to labor so much to create something out of nothing. This story has no legs, tail not head. It is not even practical to begin with. Why you find it so juicy only you and you ilk can explain.
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Post by subsaharanite on Dec 7, 2011 22:54:10 GMT 3
These guys duped Ruto and group to support them on the accepted number of counties (47) instead of the 8 original one. Now they realize they may not even have any powers. They are kin on maintaining the status quo. As much as it looks like they may achieve their quest, it may come to fruition once more thanks to Ruto and his rebel brigade.
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Post by adongo23456 on Dec 9, 2011 23:54:46 GMT 3
Here is another bonehead idea going nowhere. This fools do not understand the fact that in the US presidential elections are completely separate from senate of congress elections. They are held at different times. In Kenya all the elections are held at the same time. There is nowhere on earth where people run for ten posts at the same time. Otherwise one can ran for governorship, M.P, senate and the presidency all at once. The constitution is clear that those who run for the presidency cannot run for any other office at the same time. Trying to meddle with the Elections Act means nothing since the Elections Act has to be consistent with the constitution or it will it be null and void to the extent of the inconsistency. The good news is that many of these folks including William Ruto seem to be getting the message that their presidential ambitions are doomed to fail. Right now there are only two viable candidates namely Raila and Uhuru. The rest is junk and after they lose round one they are raia at least for five years. It will be time to look for a real job. Here is what I am talking about: www.standardmedia.co.ke/InsidePage.php?id=2000048099&cid=4&ttl=Plot%20to%20alter%20law%20for%20top%20job%20losers |
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Post by mwalimumkuu on Dec 13, 2011 7:49:24 GMT 3
Adongo,
I know not of any where in the world where one is not allowed to run for whatever position they qualify to run for. Even in the US, John Mcain has remained a senator despite having been white washed by President Obama. Today, the Michele Bachmanns of this world are running for the big office while still keeping the congress jobs.
As Musyimi says in that standard article, the Kenyan constitution is silent on this issue, and the rule of the thumb is such that, when the law is silent on an issue, it allows it. Kenyans will therefore need to get ready to elect these guys for more than one position and they will not be breaking any law.
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Post by tactician on Dec 13, 2011 9:32:28 GMT 3
Here is another bonehead idea going nowhere. This fools do not understand the fact that in the US presidential elections are completely separate from senate of congress elections. They are held at different times. In Kenya all the elections are held at the same time. There is nowhere on earth where people run for ten posts at the same time. Otherwise one can ran for governorship, M.P, senate and the presidency all at once. The constitution is clear that those who run for the presidency cannot run for any other office at the same time. Trying to meddle with the Elections Act means nothing since the Elections Act has to be consistent with the constitution or it will it be null and void to the extent of the inconsistency. The good news is that many of these folks including William Ruto seem to be getting the message that their presidential ambitions are doomed to fail. Right now there are only two viable candidates namely Raila and Uhuru. The rest is junk and after they lose round one they are raia at least for five years. It will be time to look for a real job. Here is what I am talking about: www.standardmedia.co.ke/InsidePage.php?id=2000048099&cid=4&ttl=Plot%20to%20alter%20law%20for%20top%20job%20losersWrong Adongo. Nowhere does it state in the katiba that a presidential candidate cannot run for any other elective office. But there is an Act of Parliament that bars presidential candidates from running for other elective offices. And once a presidential candidate loses, you are again wrong to say that he is a raia for five years. The same Act of Parliament allows political parties to nominate presidential candidates as members of parliament (the nomination is done before elections by political parties which will put their presidential candidates high up in the party list) And you can bet that all presidential candidates will insure themselves against losing by having their parties nominate them to bunge |
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Post by mwalimumkuu on Dec 14, 2011 16:24:40 GMT 3
After listening to Kioni's argument, I am convinced that Kenyans are making a huge mistake by allowing all these institutions to be manned by politicians without any special roles to play. We shall end up spending too much money over institutions that are not beneficial to the mwananchi at all.
Take the senate for instance, what the heck does the country need one for. Looking through all the roles and responsibilities of the senate, one gets the feeling that these are responsibilities that can easily be shared between the parliament and the county assemblies and still achieve the goals we intend to achieve.
We need to be careful not to spend too much money on useless institutions and on politicians yet we cannot pay out doctors, lecturers, teachers etc. As it is, the money the coutry will be spending on politicians alone is unimaginable, we just cant afford it.
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Post by mwalimumkuu on Dec 14, 2011 17:20:08 GMT 3
... and now Raila with with his populist statements. www.capitalfm.co.ke/news/2011/12/plan-to-scrap-senate-roguish-says-raila/This is an issue that Kenyans will need to take a very deep and long look at and interrogate very closely away from the usual party grandstanding and cheap political mileage. So far, the cost alone looks very prohibitive and takes away whatever gain intended by the proposed structure. |
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Post by mangai on Dec 14, 2011 17:28:52 GMT 3
... and now Raila with with his populist statements. www.capitalfm.co.ke/news/2011/12/plan-to-scrap-senate-roguish-says-raila/This is an issue that Kenyans will need to take a very deep and long look at and interrogate very closely away from the usual party grandstanding and cheap political mileage. So far, the cost alone looks very prohibitive and takes away whatever gain intended by the proposed structure. If the issue was cost, why cant we, for starters, do away with the proposed 80 new constituencies that are to be created and even go further to reduce the existing ones? |
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Post by merlin on Dec 14, 2011 19:26:23 GMT 3
This is an issue that Kenyans will need to take a very deep and long look at and interrogate very closely away from the usual party grandstanding and cheap political mileage. So far, the cost alone looks very prohibitive and takes away whatever gain intended by the proposed structure. Maybe it has passed your attention though we did take a very deep and long look at devolution. We discussed it and agreed it is the best possibility available to develop local initiatives, explore county resources to its fullest and share resources on a fair basis. So we voted YES for the new constitution. However there is a minority who voted against the new constitution and some of them are still dissatisfied with democratic decision taking and keep-on nattering about issues like devolution. It would be detrimental for our Nation if Masters like you spend all energies on nattering. Time has come to build what we decided. The blue print is ready and we are in need of your Master skills in mixing cement and bricklaying to build a strong prosperous Nation (In other words; be relevant and contribute). |
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Post by mwalimumkuu on Dec 22, 2011 20:12:03 GMT 3
This is an issue that Kenyans will need to take a very deep and long look at and interrogate very closely away from the usual party grandstanding and cheap political mileage. So far, the cost alone looks very prohibitive and takes away whatever gain intended by the proposed structure. Maybe it has passed your attention though we did take a very deep and long look at devolution. We discussed it and agreed it is the best possibility available to develop local initiatives, explore county resources to its fullest and share resources on a fair basis. So we voted YES for the new constitution. However there is a minority who voted against the new constitution and some of them are still dissatisfied with democratic decision taking and keep-on nattering about issues like devolution. It would be detrimental for our Nation if Masters like you spend all energies on nattering. Time has come to build what we decided. The blue print is ready and we are in need of your Master skills in mixing cement and bricklaying to build a strong prosperous Nation (In other words; be relevant and contribute). Devolution is not synonymous with the senate, in fact the two have no any direct relationship as such. In my 'mixing cement and bricklaying', I have come to the conclusion that the senate as conceived and proposed in the constitution will be an unncessary baggage to mwananchi. Kenya is a very small country with a very small economy that cannot sustain the kinds of positions we are establishing some which add no any value at all to the management and governance of the republic. Take time and look at the functions of the senate as established, you will come to the conclusion that these are functions that can easily be shared between the parliament and the county assemblies without tampering with the devolution philosophy and matrix, in fact it will be made more efficient by lessening the governance bureaucracy. I know senate sounds fancy and trendy for a western-oriented mind, but of what value is it in economic and management terms in our context? |
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Post by merlin on Dec 22, 2011 23:44:40 GMT 3
Master,Maybe it has passed your attention though we did take a very deep and long look at devolution. We discussed it and agreed it is the best possibility available to develop local initiatives, explore county resources to its fullest and share resources on a fair basis. So we voted YES for the new constitution. However there is a minority who voted against the new constitution and some of them are still dissatisfied with democratic decision taking and keep-on nattering about issues like devolution. It would be detrimental for our Nation if Masters like you spend all energies on nattering. Time has come to build what we decided. The blue print is ready and we are in need of your Master skills in mixing cement and bricklaying to build a strong prosperous Nation (In other words; be relevant and contribute). Devolution is not synonymous with the senate, in fact the two have no any direct relationship as such. In my 'mixing cement and bricklaying', I have come to the conclusion that the senate as conceived and proposed in the constitution will be an unncessary baggage to mwananchi. Kenya is a very small country with a very small economy that cannot sustain the kinds of positions we are establishing some which add no any value at all to the management and governance of the republic. Take time and look at the functions of the senate as established, you will come to the conclusion that these are functions that can easily be shared between the parliament and the county assemblies without tampering with the devolution philosophy and matrix, in fact it will be made more efficient by lessening the governance bureaucracy. I know senate sounds fancy and trendy for a western-oriented mind, but of what value is it in economic and management terms in our context? There is more than one road leading to devolution of power. However we had to move forward and the road we initially decided for in Naivasha is a compromise between different interests. It maybe does not get an Edison for the most beautiful direction though it will do for the time being as it grabs power out of the hands of autocratic presidents and moves Kenya closer to a working democracy. I find it irrelevant and futile to discuss the beauty aspect of the lady even before she can show her wisdom, power of honesty and fairness. Let’s stop this discussion; implement the constitution and evaluate the effectiveness of the Senate in about 5 year’s time. Natter means talking without content (similar to 'yammer'). Source; en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natter |
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Post by mwalimumkuu on Dec 23, 2011 17:57:33 GMT 3
Merlin,Devolution is not synonymous with the senate, in fact the two have no any direct relationship as such. In my 'mixing cement and bricklaying', I have come to the conclusion that the senate as conceived and proposed in the constitution will be an unncessary baggage to mwananchi. Kenya is a very small country with a very small economy that cannot sustain the kinds of positions we are establishing some which add no any value at all to the management and governance of the republic. Take time and look at the functions of the senate as established, you will come to the conclusion that these are functions that can easily be shared between the parliament and the county assemblies without tampering with the devolution philosophy and matrix, in fact it will be made more efficient by lessening the governance bureaucracy. I know senate sounds fancy and trendy for a western-oriented mind, but of what value is it in economic and management terms in our context? There is more than one road leading to devolution of power. However we had to move forward and the road we initially decided for in Naivasha is a compromise between different interests. It maybe does not get an Edison for the most beautiful direction though it will do for the time being as it grabs power out of the hands of autocratic presidents and moves Kenya closer to a working democracy. I find it irrelevant and futile to discuss the beauty aspect of the lady even before she can show her wisdom, power of honesty and fairness. Let’s stop this discussion; implement the constitution and evaluate the effectiveness of the Senate in about 5 year’s time. Natter means talking without content (similar to 'yammer'). Source; en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NatterHere comes your brother Merlin: kbc.co.ke/news.asp?nid=74133it is all about jobs for the big boys and girls and nothing really for Mwalimumkuu. |
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Post by phil on Jan 16, 2012 22:51:14 GMT 3
When is Jeremiah Kioni's draft bill to abolish the senate coming out? This must be a still birth.
This was one hot potato that Uhuru had drop real quick.
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Post by job on Jan 16, 2012 23:17:45 GMT 3
When is Jeremiah Kioni's draft bill to abolish the senate coming out? This must be a still birth. This was one hot potato that Uhuru had drop real quick. This is one dream of PNU's ruling elite. Abolishing the Senate weakens devolution. That's the gameplan. The moment PNU realized that even their few Rift Valley & Coast allies weren't on board, Kioni toned down the rhetoric, but the intent is still intact. |
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