The 100 Million Kitendawili from Facebook

[Onyango Oloo]

Edwin Kiama

Sun, Jun 30, 2013 at 10:35 PM

Picked off Facebook:

Via Wanjeri Nderu

KITENDAWILI TEGA!!! How many IDPs will 100 million take to resettle? How many new TEACHERS, NURSES, DOCTORS will 100 million take to hire in a year? How many new classrooms will 100 million take to build countrywide? How many new police houses will 100 million take to build? etc etc....ANSWER: There is only 100 Million to refurbish a new 400 million house inspected and opened by our very 'able' ex president 8 months ago with alot of pomp and song!!! Only in KENYA!!!

Edwin Kiama

[omundustrong]

The profligacy with which this Government is looting the coffers boogles the mind.It is as if cash is an inexhaustible resource.The house of the DP does not need this kind of money for refurbishment.When it was handed over it must have been done to the specification given by Government.If we refurbish it to meet the current occupant's specifications what will happen when someone else occupies it?

The DP has been very profligate in this aspect and the earlier he realises that being in Government is not synonymous to living large the better for all of us.The bells for actual delivery on their promises are tolling,the honeymoon is over.Let them deliver or ship out.No wonder i read elsewhere that someone's mpango wa kando was regretting not having stuck close,she would be the one swimming in the opulence one of the top dog is now enjoying.

[kamalet]

It boggles the mind how a small figure like 100 million can get everyone all excited! We have a very rich government and we seem to complain in a very selective way! For instance we (that is our government) bought Shell/BP House for 1 billion shillings and then spent another 700 million to renovate the building to a manner fit for the Prime Minister and now out good deputy president! Big houses cost a fortune to maintain. I know someone who recently spent about 400,000 shillings on a house he had only acquired two years earlier for 4.7 million!!

So why are whining about 100 million on a house originally planned to cost 500 million and had a final cost of 700 million after having lost some 300 million paid to a previous contractor? Simple - large houses....very large houses cost a fortune to maintain. Our Deputy President's house is a very large house. It is a measly 0.00625% of our budget!

[omundu]

Kamale and wa mayi.

It is not as simple as Kamale puts it.

Let me add my EXPERT opinion:

I am glad Kamale has used the former PM's office as a contrast because that is what I will use to explain how these things work.

The Shell Bp house (I think that is the former PM's office) was built in the early or mid seventies if my memory serves me right. Let us give it a two pronged approach: as a private investor and as government.

If I was a private investor, I would look at a few things including square meterage, age of the building, current and proposed use and most importantly; LOCATION, when determining the price I would buy it at. One billion dollars may be a bit far fetched considering I have got clients who have bought similar buildings in johannesburg for half the price. But there is a caveat; renovations cost roughly seven million dollars which would make sense but here is why. If I was an investor I would negotiate the buying price down and the renovation (not maintenance as we kenyans are prone to use as a word for such)would depend on intended use. My renovation costs would be lower because I would renovate it to high end residential and do my calculations to ensure (thanks to gentrification) my returns are proper enough to break even within the acceptable ten year deadline.

Government is another story. They are not supposed to use it to make profits but it was renovated into offices and that is a completely different story and here is why:

I earlier gave an indication of the age of a building. There is a phrase we use in the industry termed - wear and tear- which is obviously directly propotional to the age of a structure. Also the use/function of a building dictates the wear and tear it undergoes in its lifetime. the shell bp house was initially used as an office with heavy foot traffic. The care normally given to offices is less than say, a family home. Renovation costs in an office building like the shell house would be high because we have items like: the lift systems that may need fixing or replacing, the mechanicals like the boilers etc, the electricals and rewiring of the entire structure, the sanitary ware and plumbing of the entire building, the finishes like worn out tiles and light fittings and wall paints etc. The bills of quantities will be vast. In addition we have the furniture and IT aspect plus its wiring to add in the bills of quantities.

The total cost to the government was close to two billion. But the government looks at its returns differently like, how much it would cost to rent a similar building over a span of say fifty years, what returns will the office of the former PM or current VP give to the country etc etc.

That said, I still think the total cost of the shell house would have been maybe half what it cost especially on the buying part. And I say this because I have worked on a similar project for Luthuli house (the ANC headquarters) though one may argue that Nairobi CBD property prices are way higher that its Joburg counterpart.

Onwards to the recently completed VP house in Karen. The total construction cost was 400 million shillings (give or take added funds like consultants fees)

First, the cost did not include land purchase. The amount roughly translates to 4 million dollars. I have seen images of the residence and I can swear that Kenyan Architecture is in serious need of a Tabula Rasa because the form is badly designed. Basically it does not meet architectural standard of world architects. It is not a building I would pay four million dollars for. That said, it was finished to VP livable standards etc etc. Basically, the design of the building is still stuck in the modernist paradigm of the frank lloyd wrights of the sixties. Kamale, you would share my sentiments because I see you have traveled.

My rant above aside: the building was finished roughly a year or two ago. This brings us to the wear and tear I mentioned above. What wear and tear has happened in two years jameni ? Especially in a building no one has lived in ?

There are three stages of completion in any building project according to RIBA (royal institute of british architects) which is a system used in all commonwealth countries.
- the final works certificate - issued to the contractor when the basic structure is complete and sound.
- the final completion certificate - issued to the contractor when the finishes, doors, windows etc are done. Basically the contractor has finished the building and has handed it back to the client.
- occupation certificate. There is a period of normally two years (depending on the contract) after handover that is termed -latent defects period. This is means that in that period, the contractor is still bound by the contract and if anything goes wrong in the building eg roof leaks, broken finishes etc that happen at no fault of client, then the contractor has to fix it at own cost. They even insure against latent defects during the contractual period. The contractor the gets issued a completion certificate after this period.

In light of the above, if there is supposed to be any renovation to the VP's residence (where no one has lived by the way hahahah) it is supposed to be at the contractors cost.

That said, mujijazie why the need of 100 million shillings. In my opinion, that is money going to someones pocket or to waste.

I have a little story to tell just so you know what impact these monies can have in the lives of common mwananchi. First let's add rutos 100 milli, kibakis 250 milli (what does he need an office for yet there is nothing we know that he is doing to help the taxpayer), add 500 milli for his mweiga residence. Let's not even include the billions on laptops or the billion being spent by the lusaka dude to renovate county offices. Let's give this wanton wastage a figure, say, a billion shillings which roughly translates to ten million dollars. Here is how far that money can go:

A while back, I did a presentation on - african architecture in a contemporary idiom- for some random ANC imbizo. We were trying to establish if indeed there is an african language in our contemporary architecture and how it can be applied in a social aspect as opposed to commercial architecture. Uncle Cyril happened to be there and I was informed to contact him at a future date. A year or two later, after constantly calling, his PA introduced me to some Irish-American named Chuck Feeney. Feeney was a former very rich man who had given all his riches to his foundation and he travelled round the world visiting third world countries funding social projects like schools and hospital etc. I think his foundation is called the Atlantic Foundation Company. Interesting that their offices were located where radison blue (I understand that's where you resided last week kamale)currently sits in sandton before it was built.

This chance meeting changed my view of the social world and the impact a little money can make. A few days later we were in Hanoi, Vietnam. We moved around the country, especially the poor areas checking out the health facilities and schools. We would go into a hospital (Da Nang hospital particular strikes a cord) and check the facilities, which were dire, just like in kenya. He would leave my team working on drawings and programme details of upgrading and renovating the facilities and later just release the funds needed. In one year, with a budget of eleven million dollars, we upgraded 23 schools like the Tupi Hoa school and Thang binh to international standards (I remember those schools coz there was always a communist party human censor walking around the computer rooms. We called him the human firewall)

The Da Nang hospital (the biggest in the country) we upgraded it to include obstetrics, burns department etc. Vietnam had a problem with cataracts, especially with the rural population, we upgraded the rural hospitals in that line and by the time we left, years later, they were treating ten thousand cataract cases a year.

In eight years, feeney had spent roughly 200 million dollars in vietnam I mostly hospitals and schools to world standards and it is still a standard used there to elevate their institutions to world standards. They had four universities of poor facilities and those funds gave them ultra modern libraries, research centres, student villages etc.

That's how far, one billion shillings a year can take us. Imagine that over ten years. Any little sum adds up. 200 million dollars equates to roughly 20 billion shillings, over even five years. Now that's what we can do with those little 100 million here and there.

During that time, at his request, we even visited Ireland several times. Some university dean at Limerick university showed us pictures of the place when it was just an institute in the eighties. It has been, over time, and bit by bit of funds from Feeney, been converted into a world class university with amazing facilities. The dean did a presentation to us showing how the irish universities were elevated over seven years (starting mid eighties) from kenyan style institutions, without even foundations, directors of development and low grade facilities (we know how their economy was moribund in the eighties) to a higher education system subsequently better placed to provide graduates and researchers for the emrging celtic tiger economy of the late nineties.

To end it, it is these small wastages, like a hundred million here (that some of us claim to be small change) and another hundred million there, that add up to greater figures over time. We also suffer, since independence, from a chronic shortage of visionary leadership.

[jakaswanga]

OMUNDU WROTE:

I have a little story to tell just so you know what impact these monies can have in the lives of common mwananchi. First let's add rutos 100 milli, kibakis 250 milli (what does he need an office for yet there is nothing we know that he is doing to help the taxpayer), add 500 milli for his mweiga residence. Let's not even include the billions on laptops or the billion being spent by the lusaka dude to renovate county offices. Let's give this wanton wastage a figure, say, a billion shillings which roughly translates to ten million dollars. Here is how far that money can go:

Read more: jukwaa.proboards.com/posts/recent#ixzz2Xox8yjm6

Omundu Yo,

Thank you sana for that.

This is why I like to introduce the class aspect in social controversies. WHOSE PRIORITIES IS A GOVERNMENT SERVING?

KSH. 100m may be peanuts yes, but if you consider 1. The number of brilliant secondary school drop outs because of school fees, you could afford ALL OF THEM a bursary. [2] How many poor mum's kids die because of ROTA which can be helped by -drip-drip intravenous at KSH. 1000/DAY, you could save over a million Kenyan infants. [3] If you look at a slum like Kibera, 100 million can upgrade mud and plastic to OFFAFA KUMBINI AND MARINGO permanents ---Long gable single rooms.

By the time you add the 700M for Kibaki's new office and the others for executive jets, Kibera slum is solved.

By the way, when shell building was being bought for Raila, some of us whispered to men around him like Omwenga , that it would be an exceptional propaganda coup if he re-directed the money to build Jeri-Jerusalem type housing in one part of Kibera.
That is how fellas like me smoke a guy out. There were, according to my waragi club, no shortage of functional abode worthy of a PM's office.

Yes, how does a guy use public money. ---i took sometime leafing through how Nothern europe after the devastation of the 2nd world war, prioritised and used their MARSHAL PLAN FUNDS.

IT IS is a lesson worth learning, on how to use even 100 dollars. Buy a goat to breed, or beer to drink?

[Deleted]

Uasin Gishu boss rejects funds for new office, home

Monday, July 1, 2013 - 00:00 -- BY MATHEWS NDANYI

Uasin Gishu Governor Jackson Mandago has rejected a Sh650 million budget allocation to build him a new office.He has cancelled a plan to build him a new home saying there were more pressing matters.

"We had allocated the money to put up a new office for him because the current office at the municipal hall has no adequate space but the governor refused the project saying it was not a priority for him," said the county Budget and Appropriations Committee chair Jonathan Rotich.

Mandago has opted to continue using the former office of the Eldoret Mayor.The county assembly approved the Sh 5.8 billion budget after it was adjusted to remove the Sh650 million project.

Half of the budget will be used on salaries and other personnel issues.Mandago's office will spend Sh416 million of the Sh2 billion allocations.

The office will use Sh280 million on its operations while the House has been allocated Sh553 million. The county will raise Sh1.4 billion from local resources to boost the Sh4.3 billion from the national government.

Mandago said they have allocated Sh 1.3 billion to rehabilitate roads."We know having good roads will spur economic development in all sectors. That why we want to spend massively on refurbishing roads in our first budget before we move on to other areas," he said.

Mandago said his administration will prioritise agriculture because the region is a high producing area for maize and wheat.The county has allocated Sh2.059 billion to capital expenditures including Sh260 million for Public Health Services and another Sh200 million to education.

Among key projects are installation of Sh80 million CCTV cameras in Eldoret town, street lighting at a cost of Sh90 million, construction of a milling plant at Sh75 million and another Sh50 million will be used to build and expand nursery schools

www.the-star.co.ke/news/article-126342/uasin-gishu-boss-rejects-funds-new-office-home
- See more at: www.the-star.co.ke/news/article-126342/uasin-gishu-boss-rejects-funds-new-office-home#sthash.5c8GVaRG.dpuf

[omundu]

Jul 1, 2013 21:56:35 GMT 3 jakaswanga said:

OMUNDU WROTE:

I have a little story to tell just so you know what impact these monies can have in the lives of common mwananchi. First let's add rutos 100 milli, kibakis 250 milli (what does he need an office for yet there is nothing we know that he is doing to help the taxpayer), add 500 milli for his mweiga residence. Let's not even include the billions on laptops or the billion being spent by the lusaka dude to renovate county offices. Let's give this wanton wastage a figure, say, a billion shillings which roughly translates to ten million dollars. Here is how far that money can go:

Read more: jukwaa.proboards.com/posts/recent#ixzz2Xox8yjm6

Omundu Yo,

Thank you sana for that.

This is why I like to introduce the class aspect in social controversies. WHOSE PRIORITIES IS A GOVERNMENT SERVING?

KSH. 100m may be peanuts yes, but if you consider 1. The number of brilliant secondary school drop outs because of school fees, you could afford ALL OF THEM a bursary. [2] How many poor mum's kids die because of ROTA which can be helped by -drip-drip intravenous at KSH. 1000/DAY, you could save over a million Kenyan infants. [3] If you look at a slum like Kibera, 100 million can upgrade mud and plastic to OFFAFA KUMBINI AND MARINGO permanents ---Long gable single rooms.

By the time you add the 700M for Kibaki's new office and the others for executive jets, Kibera slum is solved.

By the way, when shell building was being bought for Raila, some of us whispered to men around him like Omwenga , that it would be an exceptional propaganda coup if he re-directed the money to build Jeri-Jerusalem type housing in one part of Kibera.
That is how fellas like me smoke a guy out. There were, according to my waragi club, no shortage of functional abode worthy of a PM's office.

Yes, how does a guy use public money. ---i took sometime leafing through how Nothern europe after the devastation of the 2nd world war, prioritised and used their MARSHAL PLAN FUNDS.

IT IS is a lesson worth learning, on how to use even 100 dollars. Buy a goat to breed, or beer to drink?

Indeed Jakaswanga.

There is a reason countries like China and Australia are envious (to the point of trying to emulate) economic models of South American countries like Equador, Venezuela and especially Brazil.

Brazil, in a decade or so, has managed to lift millions out of poverty and continues to do so, thanks to the current and former revolutionary presidents. The lula's and them.

They understood that it is not the keynesian model I think (prone to wastage, corruption and greed) but the bottom up approach, that improves a county's economy. They are currently protesting in Brazil because, through trial, the have seen what those billions, currently being used on stadia, can actually do to the lumpen proletariat, proletariat and eventually, entire country's economy. Heck, they managed to achieve BRIC status faster than we will ever dream achieving vision 2030. Interesting that in the other thread on nobama, someone does not understand the dimension of time in governance and economic models (don't worry, I will get to the thread in due time)

Obama gave an example of Senegal in his IMBIZO (townhall) speech at UJ.

Apparently, the senegalese government embarked on an Agricultural policy a few years ago. Any rural citizen with an acre or two, could access a certain grant/loan specifically set up for industrialization of the small farm owners inorder to increase production. Tractors and other machinery were bought by the farm owners, who eventually increased production. The produce was pooled and sold regionally. Apparently the programme is achieving so much success that many farmers have even increased their acreage to over fifty acres. Food security in that area will be achieved in a few years if the programme continues and it is self sustaining. Mwananchi does not need hand outs, they just need a push like this and other examples like vietnam or ireland shows. I guess west africa may soon undergo its agrarian/industrial revolution.

We can also do this with visionary leaders like the example Kathure just posted.

[omundustrong]

Omundu and Jakaswanga(One day would love to join the waragi club)Thanks for the expert advice Omundu, now we know and appreciate the importance of not being penny wise and pound foolish like some of us would have us believe.If it is a bad deal it is a bad deal it is a bad deal.Repetition is intentional.

We are not whining but just pointing out misplaced priorities in Government,what is good for the goose should be good for the gander.As Jakaswanga has put it if the former Prime Minister was profligate in his expenditure on the building of which he rightfully condemns, it does not make sense to justify the bad spending now on a bad spending then.

We shall continue to rant here as my brother Omundu puts it ,even if the stone does not respond it will have heard!

[kamalet]

Guys

I think 100 million is peanuts and insist thus! We have a budget of 1.6 trillion shillings and we mourn about 100 million - come on guys! Mwalimu Jakaswanga only seems to see it from the point of view of how many bright children the 100 million can educate. Unfortunately it only takes 4 years to educate such characters and then what happens to future clever ones after we run out of the 100 million? If you want to make a fuss about how government money is wasted (oops...spent!)then do not look at money voted for development, seek out the recurrent revenue items for at least these can be voted for year in year out once appropriated!

Our good and hard working DP has only moved to the house and as the inhabitant of the house, there are several shortfalls he has noticed such as a complete lack of CCTV equipment to ensure his security! Those MOW guys that took over the house from the contractor much have taken kickbacks to sign off the house as complete and then went out of their way to cheat our great former president to preside over the handing over of the house knowing fully well that he is a man that had little care for some of these things like houses - what about that mansion in Mweiga he visited only once when it was under construction and has refused to relocate to preferring the serenity of Muthaiga? When you take in all this into consideration, I believe that our hard working DP is justified to get the 100 million to fix the cracks and get some china emblazoned with the court of arms and the name of the residence in gold trimmings!

[omundu]

Jul 2, 2013 9:35:27 GMT 3 kamalet said:

Guys

I think 100 million is peanuts and insist thus! We have a budget of 1.6 trillion shillings and we mourn about 100 million - come on guys! Mwalimu Jakaswanga only seems to see it from the point of view of how many bright children the 100 million can educate. Unfortunately it only takes 4 years to educate such characters and then what happens to future clever ones after we run out of the 100 million? If you want to make a fuss about how government money is wasted (oops...spent!)then do not look at money voted for development, seek out the recurrent revenue items for at least these can be voted for year in year out once appropriated!

Our good and hard working DP has only moved to the house and as the inhabitant of the house, there are several shortfalls he has noticed such as a complete lack of CCTV equipment to ensure his security! Those MOW guys that took over the house from the contractor much have taken kickbacks to sign off the house as complete and then went out of their way to cheat our great former president to preside over the handing over of the house knowing fully well that he is a man that had little care for some of these things like houses - what about that mansion in Mweiga he visited only once when it was under construction and has refused to relocate to preferring the serenity of Muthaiga? When you take in all this into consideration, I believe that our hard working DP is justified to get the 100 million to fix the cracks and get some china emblazoned with the court of arms and the name of the residence in gold trimmings!

A guy, let's get things straight:

On matters pertaining construction, I am not here to discuss with you. Discussion is what I do with my peers in the field. I am here to teach you.

The NERVE. Ati sijui cctv. Do you even know installation costs etc of such ? A whole VP house comes with all security features by final completion. And I just learnt the house is not even a year old. Refer back to my comment on latent defects period dude. Don't come here vomiting nonesense bwana. It is actually becoming sickening.

Then you say it is little money whilst we are way past the red in budget shortfalls. Apparently over 300 billion shillings.

Do you even read other threads in jukwaa dude ?

[kamalet]

Jul 2, 2013 11:17:09 GMT 3 omundu said:

Jul 2, 2013 9:35:27 GMT 3 kamalet said:

Guys

I think 100 million is peanuts and insist thus! We have a budget of 1.6 trillion shillings and we mourn about 100 million - come on guys! Mwalimu Jakaswanga only seems to see it from the point of view of how many bright children the 100 million can educate. Unfortunately it only takes 4 years to educate such characters and then what happens to future clever ones after we run out of the 100 million? If you want to make a fuss about how government money is wasted (oops...spent!)then do not look at money voted for development, seek out the recurrent revenue items for at least these can be voted for year in year out once appropriated!

Our good and hard working DP has only moved to the house and as the inhabitant of the house, there are several shortfalls he has noticed such as a complete lack of CCTV equipment to ensure his security! Those MOW guys that took over the house from the contractor much have taken kickbacks to sign off the house as complete and then went out of their way to cheat our great former president to preside over the handing over of the house knowing fully well that he is a man that had little care for some of these things like houses - what about that mansion in Mweiga he visited only once when it was under construction and has refused to relocate to preferring the serenity of Muthaiga? When you take in all this into consideration, I believe that our hard working DP is justified to get the 100 million to fix the cracks and get some china emblazoned with the court of arms and the name of the residence in gold trimmings!

A guy, let's get things straight:

On matters pertaining construction, I am not here to discuss with you. Discussion is what I do with my peers in the field. I am here to teach you.

The NERVE. Ati sijui cctv. Do you even know installation costs etc of such ? A whole VP house comes with all security features by final completion. And I just learnt the house is not even a year old. Refer back to my comment on latent defects period dude. Don't come here vomiting nonesense bwana. It is actually becoming sickening.

Then you say it is little money whilst we are way past the red in budget shortfalls. Apparently over 300 billion shillings.

Do you even read other threads in jukwaa dude ?

Omundu

I have never had to carry a karai of korogwad concrete on my head in a construction site, so I shall lift my hard hat for you in matters of construction. In fact you would best be served talking about concrete mixing than even reading what we post here in Jukwaa and have done since it started as you probably learnt how to get the mixing ratios of cement and concrete right......not only do we read, we write! That is why you cannot even get the deficit right!

Here is something for you....go back and read what I wrote and you will perhaps understand the cost of CCTV relative to the additional 100 million our dear hard working deputy president needs for fixing his house. We do live in houses our here in Kenya and not on trees......certainly prettier stuff than Luthuli House on Sauer Street.

[mank]

Jul 2, 2013 9:35:27 GMT 3 kamalet said:

Guys

I think 100 million is peanuts and insist thus! We have a budget of 1.6 trillion shillings and we mourn about 100 million - come on guys! Mwalimu Jakaswanga only seems to see it from the point of view of how many bright children the 100 million can educate. Unfortunately it only takes 4 years to educate such characters and then what happens to future clever ones after we run out of the 100 million? If you want to make a fuss about how government money is wasted (oops...spent!)then do not look at money voted for development, seek out the recurrent revenue items for at least these can be voted for year in year out once appropriated!

Our good and hard working DP has only moved to the house and as the inhabitant of the house, there are several shortfalls he has noticed such as a complete lack of CCTV equipment to ensure his security! Those MOW guys that took over the house from the contractor much have taken kickbacks to sign off the house as complete and then went out of their way to cheat our great former president to preside over the handing over of the house knowing fully well that he is a man that had little care for some of these things like houses - what about that mansion in Mweiga he visited only once when it was under construction and has refused to relocate to preferring the serenity of Muthaiga? When you take in all this into consideration, I believe that our hard working DP is justified to get the 100 million to fix the cracks and get some china emblazoned with the court of arms and the name of the residence in gold trimmings!

Kamale you are thinking about the size of the lump that's wasted when indeed efficiency is about allocating each shilling to the most deserving course. If we say sh. 100 m is too small, then even a trillion is too small (you can divide a trillion into bundles of a 100 m, and if each bundle is too small for a difference then the sum of them (that is the trillion) must be insignificant.

[omundu]

Jul 2, 2013 12:18:15 GMT 3 kamalet said:

Jul 2, 2013 11:17:09 GMT 3 omundu said:

A guy, let's get things straight:

On matters pertaining construction, I am not here to discuss with you. Discussion is what I do with my peers in the field. I am here to teach you.

The NERVE. Ati sijui cctv. Do you even know installation costs etc of such ? A whole VP house comes with all security features by final completion. And I just learnt the house is not even a year old. Refer back to my comment on latent defects period dude. Don't come here vomiting nonesense bwana. It is actually becoming sickening.

Then you say it is little money whilst we are way past the red in budget shortfalls. Apparently over 300 billion shillings.

Do you even read other threads in jukwaa dude ?

Omundu

I have never had to carry a karai of korogwad concrete on my head in a construction site, so I shall lift my hard hat for you in matters of construction. In fact you would best be served talking about concrete mixing than even reading what we post here in Jukwaa and have done since it started as you probably learnt how to get the mixing ratios of cement and concrete right......not only do we read, we write! That is why you cannot even get the deficit right!

Here is something for you....go back and read what I wrote and you will perhaps understand the cost of CCTV relative to the additional 100 million our dear hard working deputy president needs for fixing his house. We do live in houses our here in Kenya and not on trees......certainly prettier stuff than Luthuli House on Sauer Street.

Hahahahaha.

I am enduringly mystified that there can be so much pride and certainty in such ignorance.

[kamalet]

Jul 2, 2013 17:38:31 GMT 3 mank said:

Jul 2, 2013 9:35:27 GMT 3 kamalet said:

Guys

I think 100 million is peanuts and insist thus! We have a budget of 1.6 trillion shillings and we mourn about 100 million - come on guys! Mwalimu Jakaswanga only seems to see it from the point of view of how many bright children the 100 million can educate. Unfortunately it only takes 4 years to educate such characters and then what happens to future clever ones after we run out of the 100 million? If you want to make a fuss about how government money is wasted (oops...spent!)then do not look at money voted for development, seek out the recurrent revenue items for at least these can be voted for year in year out once appropriated!

Our good and hard working DP has only moved to the house and as the inhabitant of the house, there are several shortfalls he has noticed such as a complete lack of CCTV equipment to ensure his security! Those MOW guys that took over the house from the contractor much have taken kickbacks to sign off the house as complete and then went out of their way to cheat our great former president to preside over the handing over of the house knowing fully well that he is a man that had little care for some of these things like houses - what about that mansion in Mweiga he visited only once when it was under construction and has refused to relocate to preferring the serenity of Muthaiga? When you take in all this into consideration, I believe that our hard working DP is justified to get the 100 million to fix the cracks and get some china emblazoned with the court of arms and the name of the residence in gold trimmings!

Kamale you are thinking about the size of the lump that's wasted when indeed efficiency is about allocating each shilling to the most deserving course. If we say sh. 100 m is too small, then even a trillion is too small (you can divide a trillion into bundles of a 100 m, and if each bundle is too small for a difference then the sum of them (that is the trillion) must be insignificant.

Mank

For a government with pretty good ideas of taking us to the next level, what galls me is this view some of those in it that there is a bottomless pit of money for which to pay for virtually anything! So if you try and see it from the government's perspective 100 million cannot be too much money...can it?

[jakaswanga]

Jul 2, 2013 22:27:29 GMT 3 kamalet said:

Jul 2, 2013 17:38:31 GMT 3 mank said:

Kamale you are thinking about the size of the lump that's wasted when indeed efficiency is about allocating each shilling to the most deserving course. If we say sh. 100 m is too small, then even a trillion is too small (you can divide a trillion into bundles of a 100 m, and if each bundle is too small for a difference then the sum of them (that is the trillion) must be insignificant.

Mank

For a government with pretty good ideas of taking us to the next level, what galls me is this view some of those in it that there is a bottomless pit of money for which to pay for virtually anything! So if you try and see it from the government's perspective 100 million cannot be too much money...can it?

Kamalet, if for one moment one would see it from the government's perspective, and indeed conclude under our circumstances of 100M is no big deal, the conclusion would be it is a government in a deluded state of mind.

Do you remember what I told you about haircuts, and the cumulative effect. That is saving 100M form 100 different government departments gives you a neat pile at the end.

[mank]

Jul 2, 2013 22:27:29 GMT 3 kamalet said:

Jul 2, 2013 17:38:31 GMT 3 mank said:

Kamale you are thinking about the size of the lump that's wasted when indeed efficiency is about allocating each shilling to the most deserving course. If we say sh. 100 m is too small, then even a trillion is too small (you can divide a trillion into bundles of a 100 m, and if each bundle is too small for a difference then the sum of them (that is the trillion) must be insignificant.

Mank

For a government with pretty good ideas of taking us to the next level, what galls me is this view some of those in it that there is a bottomless pit of money for which to pay for virtually anything! So if you try and see it from the government's perspective 100 million cannot be too much money...can it?

Jakaswanga, I will tell you something about that government.  Its a government that has failed to learn what we all learned when we were little.

In my case, when I was little, I would sneak in the kitchen and put a spoonful of sugar in my mouth. I would figure a spoonful would not make a difference. Unfortunately the flavour would keep me coming back .... stupid, stupid kid! By the time mama went to make tea since the last, a cupful would need to be accounted for.   That was a long time folks, and only mama's sugar .... Now, assuming that the government is comprised of people who were not as adventurers as I was, why not just take it from the wise ones who said: Chovya chovya humaliza buyu?

[jakaswanga]

Jul 3, 2013 0:34:52 GMT 3 mank said:

Jakaswanga, I will tell you something about that government.  Its a government that has failed to learn what we all learned when we were little.

In my case, when I was little, I would sneak in the kitchen and put a spoonful of sugar in my mouth. I would figure a spoonful would not make a difference. Unfortunately the flavour would keep me coming back .... stupid, stupid kid! By the time mama went to make tea since the last, a cupful would need to be accounted for.   That was a long time folks, and only mama's sugar .... Now, assuming that the government is comprised of people who were not as adventurers as I was, why not just take it from the wise ones who said: Chovya chovya humaliza buyu?

That story, Brother Mank, is a very powerful illustration ---a teaching aid-- of the issue. By the way there is an article I read here yesterday linked from Jaindi Kisero, and it too did a nice job explaining what happens when you spend too much on salaries: like you build a hospital and pay the docs and nurses, only you do not have money to buy equipment nor medicine. So all you have is a building called a hospital, but offering the services of a morgue!
jaindi used other words. I will find it presently and re-linke it here for you!

Mank: why do you think secretary Rotich of finance is so cool about it? I mean it is not like he is rubbing it in what the consequences really are of this run-away recurrent expenditure! [something he knows we don't?]

Mank: Jaindi's missive was linked by Omundustong here [should laptop money be used to pay for my waragi indulgences?? ]
jukwaa.proboards.com/thread/8544/laptop-money-used-pay-teachers

[mank]

Jul 3, 2013 19:37:20 GMT 3 jakaswanga said:

Jul 3, 2013 0:34:52 GMT 3 mank said:

Jakaswanga, I will tell you something about that government.  Its a government that has failed to learn what we all learned when we were little.

In my case, when I was little, I would sneak in the kitchen and put a spoonful of sugar in my mouth. I would figure a spoonful would not make a difference. Unfortunately the flavour would keep me coming back .... stupid, stupid kid! By the time mama went to make tea since the last, a cupful would need to be accounted for.   That was a long time folks, and only mama's sugar .... Now, assuming that the government is comprised of people who were not as adventurers as I was, why not just take it from the wise ones who said: Chovya chovya humaliza buyu?

That story, Brother Mank, is a very powerful illustration ---a teaching aid-- of the issue. By the way there is an article I read here yesterday linked from Jaindi Kisero, and it too did a nice job explaining what happens when you spend too much on salaries: like you build a hospital and pay the docs and nurses, only you do not have money to buy equipment nor medicine. So all you have is a building called a hospital, but offering the services of a morgue!
jaindi used other words. I will find it presently and re-linke it here for you!

Mank: why do you think secretary Rotich of finance is so cool about it? I mean it is not like he is rubbing it in what the consequences really are of this run-away recurrent expenditure! [something he knows we don't?]

Mank: Jaindi's missive was linked by Omundustong here [should laptop money be used to pay for my waragi indulgences?? ]
jukwaa.proboards.com/thread/8544/laptop-money-used-pay-teachers

Brother Jakaswanga, you are cracking my rib cage mate! Ati a hospital offers the services of a morgue .... .

[mank]

Jul 2, 2013 22:46:07 GMT 3 jakaswanga said:

Jul 2, 2013 22:27:29 GMT 3 kamalet said:

Mank

For a government with pretty good ideas of taking us to the next level, what galls me is this view some of those in it that there is a bottomless pit of money for which to pay for virtually anything! So if you try and see it from the government's perspective 100 million cannot be too much money...can it?

Kamalet, if for one moment one would see it from the government's perspective, and indeed conclude under our circumstances of 100M is no big deal, the conclusion would be it is a government in a deluded state of mind.

Do you remember what I told you about haircuts, and the cumulative effect. That is saving 100M form 100 different government departments gives you a neat pile at the end.

Jakaswanga,

I think Kamale was being sarcastic. He agrees. Chovya chovya ...

[jakaswanga]

Aug 1, 2013 2:38:40 GMT 3 mank said:

Jul 2, 2013 22:46:07 GMT 3 jakaswanga said:

Kamalet, if for one moment one would see it from the government's perspective, and indeed conclude under our circumstances of 100M is no big deal, the conclusion would be it is a government in a deluded state of mind.

Do you remember what I told you about haircuts, and the cumulative effect. That is saving 100M form 100 different government departments gives you a neat pile at the end.

Jakaswanga,

I think Kamale was being sarcastic. He agrees. Chovya chovya ...

yeah, chovya chovya! I know he has an unorthodox sense of humour! But like him, one thing confuses me: where do rivers flow towards? Upstream or downstream?