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Post by Onyango Oloo on Apr 14, 2015 0:23:42 GMT 3
Kenyan civil society organizations are convening a press conference on Tuesday, April 14, 2015 from 10 to 11 am at the KENYA HUMAN RIGHTS COMMISSION offices, Gitanga Road opposite Valley Arcade shopping centre, Lavington, Nairobi to denounce the freezing of the accounts of Haki Africa and MUHURI and demand the immediate removal of the two human rights bodies from the terrorist list.
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Post by kamalet on Apr 14, 2015 9:30:14 GMT 3
Kenyan civil society organizations are convening a press conference on Tuesday, April 14, 2015 from 10 to 11 am at the KENYA HUMAN RIGHTS COMMISSION offices, Gitanga Road opposite Valley Arcade shopping centre, Lavington, Nairobi to denounce the freezing of the accounts of Haki Africa and MUHURI and demand the immediate removal of the two human rights bodies from the terrorist list. Even mad men claim they are not mad......! Why don't they go clear their names against their accusers rather than address a public with pre-determined denials? If they are innocent, they should go to South C and clear their names then come back to the public after clearance? |
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Post by OtishOtish on Apr 14, 2015 17:38:44 GMT 3
The "Gazette Notice" (no. 2326) pretty much said " we accuse you of being terrorists!; you have 24 hours to prove you are not!": www.garoweonline.com/garowe/resources/2015/04/jHBPYqPM.pdf(Note the wording: "LIST OF TERRORIST ORGANIZATIONS". Not even "suspected".) It now looks like they've been given a few more days. Still, where does an innocent person/organization begin when faced with such a charge? I certainly wouldn't know where to start. |
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Post by b6k on Apr 14, 2015 17:56:22 GMT 3
Still, where does an innocent person/organization begin when faced with such a charge? I certainly wouldn't know where to start. Well, other than a press conference right off the bat why not try and start at a court of law. If after you have filed your case for defamation/wrongful closure of accounts &/or business you still wish to yap about it then a presser giving limited details of your case AFTER court would make some sense, ama? |
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Post by OtishOtish on Apr 14, 2015 18:24:55 GMT 3
Well, other than a press conference right off the bat why not try and start at a court of law. If after you have filed your case for defamation/wrongful closure of accounts &/or business you still wish to yap about it then a presser giving limited details of your case AFTER court would make some sense, ama? Court of law? It appears that according to whatever Kenyan law is being applied, it is to their accuser, who has already made up "his"/"her" mind, that they should prove their innocence. The 24 hours or 5 days involves no courts. A press conference "right off the bat" is actually an excellent idea: sufficient public outrage could save them the trouble, time and expense of battling the government in a court of law. Beyond that, a press conference as the first order of business is necessary to make sure that the public is promptly informed of the parties innocence. It is also a very funny idea that one should denounce injustice only after failing in the courts. Lastly, we--at least I---do not know of what legal steps they are taking concurrently with the press conferences. |
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Post by b6k on Apr 14, 2015 22:09:03 GMT 3
Otishotish, there's a difference between public opinion and civil society opinion. Sometimes the two converge. On all things Al Shabaab I can assure you the two are oceans apart...
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Post by OtishOtish on Apr 14, 2015 23:05:26 GMT 3
Otishotish, there's a difference between public opinion and civil society opinion. Sometimes the two converge. On all things Al Shabaab I can assure you the two are oceans apart... That might well be the case. I don't know. (1) I have as yet not seen the exact connection to Al Shabaab. (2) I have as yet not seen anything to suggest that the public supports this lazily-thought-out "stern action". (3) You expressed some unhappiness with the press conference. I can't quite put my finger on the basis of that, but I thought I'd try to point out that the press conference is not necessarily a bad idea. P.S. If the person/people who come up with these ideas---wall, throw out refugees, bring in the corrupt would-be coppers etc---can find chicken-heads on which they could upgrade, then recent medical progress offers them some hope: www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/292306.phpOtherwise, they should slow down. |
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Post by b6k on Apr 15, 2015 0:28:12 GMT 3
Here's one civil society position I totally agree with.
Dadaab has little to do with Al Shabaab and the folks in those 5 separate towns that make the camp are so remotely situated that only a madman would attempt to leave the camps and trek towards KE proper.
Having seen PEV and how Kenyans had to flee to neighboring countries it's a grave mistake for us to kick genuine and bona fide refugees out.
As for Al Shabaab channels of financing that's a totally different proposition.
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Post by OtishOtish on Apr 15, 2015 2:23:03 GMT 3
Forget that no clear link has been established between these organization and terrorism. The government is engaged in a mindless repeat of the "shutting down" it did at the end of last year, and anyone---e.g. you, b6k--who supports the current activity should first ask what was achieved in 2014. What is more incredible is the notion that this sort of attack requires some real financing from some organization that supports terrorism. For anyone who is minded to commit such atrocities, the starting point would be where to get guns, ammunition, and so forth. Those are not hard to come by, even in places like Nairobi. What's more, the most "reliable" suppliers of such are probably Kenyan security personnel. For those who want a real bargain or who require certain types of high-quality material, the "tribal bandits"---and they are as Kenyan as they come---will probably provide a better shop. On the cheap side, they have "confiscated" quite a bit of government material, and all those "return-by" deadlines don't seem to bother them; on the high-quality side, they have their own cross-border suppliers. (Oh, by the way, those "tribal bandits" routinely slaughter even cops, and hardly anyone worries about their "financing".) The notion that internal rot can be dealt with by plastering Band-Aid in some other place is a peculiar one. People are now asking " wasn't anything learned from Westgate, Mpeketoni, Mandera, ...?". With such a learning-proof government, we can now add Garissa to the list for the next time that question gets asked. The only thing that some of these actions will, in their blanket condemnation achieve, is to get more people desperate and very pissed off. It's astonishing to see seemingly intelligent people (in GoK) engaged in such self-defeating activities. Somebody at the top of GoK needs to take advantage of this sort of medical advance and upgrade: www.businessinsider.com/man-wants-to-get-the-worlds-first-head-transplant-2015-4The way things are, even a chicken-head will do. |
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Post by b6k on Apr 15, 2015 6:18:32 GMT 3
Otishotish, the problem with your activist type of thinking is that an observer would be left with the opinion that EVERYTHING GK does is wrong or illegal. Where you look at the move banning Hawala as illegal and draconian I look at it as a move to squeeze the financial lifeblood of the Somali community, even if temporarily, by forcing responsible contributors within the community to the bargaining table. These responsible contributors can then ATTEMPT to influence the disgruntled elements who use their services to take a more softly softly approach where Kenyan interests are involved. Besides GK isn't the first to ban these money transfer outfits. Remember all the troubles the likes of Barclays, Standard Chartered and UBS Banks had a couple years ago? Well working with Hawalas led them to handling some dodgy transactions that landed them in hot soup. Even they have lashed out at Hawalas to at least get them to be a tad more accountable as far as who they send their monies to. Read more below: Hawala and the Diminishing Humanitarian Space Abdurahman Sharif The repercussions of Barclays closing 80 accounts held by money remitters have the possibility of being extremely detrimental to millions of Somalis who rely on these funds to live. Remittances are a lifeline to Somalis that is estimated to be worth as much as US$1.2 billion every year - more than the entire humanitarian support the country receives. For a country that doesn't have a banking system, this is the only way millions are able to receive cash for basic necessities. The closure has even led to the Somali Prime Minister, Abdi Farah Shirdon, to speak out against the move. Banks are key instruments for the financial transfer of accumulated remittance deposits. They also act as "proxy regulators" used by governments to combat money laundering and terrorist financing. However, they often have a meagre understanding on how money remitters operate. As a result, and because of the risk averse nature of banks, they would prefer not to do business with remittance companies. Banks in the UK have come under ever increasing scrutiny from regulators in relation to international financial transfers. In August 2010, Barclays was ordered to pay $298m (£190m) and Standard Chartered, in December 2012, was asked to pay more than $300 million in fines to the US authorities for violating international sanctions by handling hundreds of millions of dollars in clandestine transactions with banks in Cuba, Iran, Libya, Sudan and Burma. It is fair to say that banks have had their nerves frayed at the edges by having to pay hefty fines. This has shifted the focus on organisations that deal with transferring money, often to countries which have financial systems that are less than stable - most notably Hawala and humanitarian organisations. A Hawala is a money transfer system which has its origins in the Arab world and is largely based on trust and are common in area such as Somalia and the Horn of Africa. In October of last year, UK based charity Islamic Relief had their account closed by UBS as well as incoming donations blocked into the account - ultimately affecting the work taking place on the ground. Similarly, many other relief organisations have had an increasing problem with banking including opening an account, delays and blocks in transferring funds and receiving donations from abroad - all of which has impacted on the assistance provided of these charities. There are several regulated Hawala in the UK and USA. Dahabshiil, the largest money remitter to Somalia, is registered and regulated by the Financial Services Authority (FSA) in the UK. This means that it will have to respond to the FSA for any wrongdoing in the same way banks have had to respond to the same entity in the aftermath of the credit crunch. This begs the question, if banks are coming under increased scrutiny and charities as well as Hawala are bearing the brunt of the over cautiousness by banks, surely there is another way. Hawala are a very popular partner chosen by humanitarian agencies to distribute cash in Somalia. It enables a safe and quick disbursement of money to beneficiaries in a project area. This opportunity is increasingly exploited by aid agencies operating in complex situations like Somalia where the weak local administration and the security risk undermine humanitarian response. In a sector where a successful timely response to a crisis is heavily linked to the readily accessible funds, a discussion needs to take place to ensure that charities and registered money transfer services can serve their beneficiaries without obstacles in the way that could lead to the loss of life. Regulators need to do more to address this problem by working with money transfer services and charities, to have a greater understanding of how these organisations work and how stringent regulation can negatively impact their work. m.huffpost.com/uk/entry/3586453 |
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Post by OtishOtish on Apr 15, 2015 15:33:27 GMT 3
I look at it as a move to squeeze the financial lifeblood of the Somali community It's good that you see where the problem is. |
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Post by Onyango Oloo on Apr 15, 2015 17:00:23 GMT 3
Even mad men claim they are not mad......! Why don't they go clear their names against their accusers rather than address a public with pre-determined denials? If they are innocent, they should go to South C and clear their names then come back to the public after clearance?
Kamale:I would be lying if I claimed to be slightly "surprised" by your pro-establishment, cynical and totally misinformed retort.
You are saying that if I accused you here on Jukwaa of being an NIS agent, as some people have mistakenly done in the past, then your argument is that the onus is on you Kamale to "PROVE" that you are not an intelligence plant on this forum?
Does that make SENSE even to YOU at your most rabid partisan moment?Incidentally, please take a look at the following short article from the Standard: |
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Post by Onyango Oloo on Apr 15, 2015 17:37:50 GMT 3
Well, other than a press conference right off the bat why not try and start at a court of law. If after you have filed your case for defamation/wrongful closure of accounts &/or business you still wish to yap about it then a presser giving limited details of your case AFTER court would make some sense, ama? We went to court on FRIDAY. The press conference was on Tuesday. OO |
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Post by OtishOtish on Apr 16, 2015 1:09:20 GMT 3
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Post by podp on Apr 16, 2015 4:34:23 GMT 3
Well, other than a press conference right off the bat why not try and start at a court of law. If after you have filed your case for defamation/wrongful closure of accounts &/or business you still wish to yap about it then a presser giving limited details of your case AFTER court would make some sense, ama?We went to court on FRIDAY. The press conference was on Tuesday. OO today a discussion with a fellow teacher yielded interesting not. my students, she explained, just stare at us as we try to cheer them up about tomorrow. well, I responded, much as we tell them 'someni vijana; mwisho wa kusoma; utapata kazi nzuri sana!' they know of predecessors who donkey years later have not faired ny better. so reading the above red high light it occurred to me we as a people are no longer communicating to one another compassionately but always mocking each other |
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Post by podp on Apr 16, 2015 4:40:40 GMT 3
after the list of shame was exposed, the main conduit of stealing government money to finance elections is no longer lucrative, unless the Auditor General can be barred legally from disclosing any more 'stealing' from the security docket. hence the building of the wall along Kenya and Somali border is the new kid on the block way of still stealing the security expenditure allocation. who will dare walk along the Kenya and Somali border to confirm the presence of a wall? |
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Post by b6k on Apr 16, 2015 8:14:12 GMT 3
I look at it as a move to squeeze the financial lifeblood of the Somali community It's good that you see where the problem is. Thank you. |
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Post by b6k on Apr 16, 2015 8:15:42 GMT 3
Well, other than a press conference right off the bat why not try and start at a court of law. If after you have filed your case for defamation/wrongful closure of accounts &/or business you still wish to yap about it then a presser giving limited details of your case AFTER court would make some sense, ama? We went to court on FRIDAY. The press conference was on Tuesday. OO I stand corrected. Let us know how you fare in the courts. |
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Post by b6k on Apr 16, 2015 8:23:20 GMT 3
Idle young men will always seek refuge in groups or gangs they perceive to be powerful since an idle mind is the devil's workshop. Destroy Al Shabaab and they'll have to look elsewhere. The day a legitimate threat emerges from Bungoma or Mombasa is the day consideration for building a wall may be valid. |
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Post by kamalet on Apr 16, 2015 8:48:17 GMT 3
Even mad men claim they are not mad......! Why don't they go clear their names against their accusers rather than address a public with pre-determined denials? If they are innocent, they should go to South C and clear their names then come back to the public after clearance?
Kamale:I would be lying if I claimed to be slightly "surprised" by your pro-establishment, cynical and totally misinformed retort.
You are saying that if I accused you here on Jukwaa of being an NIS agent, as some people have mistakenly done in the past, then your argument is that the onus is on you Kamale to "PROVE" that you are not an intelligence plant on this forum?
Does that make SENSE even to YOU at your most rabid partisan moment?Incidentally, please take a look at the following short article from the Standard: OO Would I then be right to suggest that merely because you do not agree with the 'establishment' you are anti-establishment? What the 'hactivists' have done by going to court to contest the decision is "right" to the extent that they felt wronged. Now Boinett will be forced to provide the evidence in as much as they would have achieved the same had they gone to South C!! Incidentally this is all very different to reference to me being an 'agent'! If it offended me as much as calling me a dog would offend me, then I would have a case of asking you to show me the tail but it does not offend me so I do not have to prove anything. However if you accuse me of fraud, then I would come to you show me your evidence of fraud if I believe I have not committed a fraud or in the alternative if am too pig headed would go to court to get you to show me the evidence! Now what is the difference? |
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Post by jakaswanga on Apr 16, 2015 11:30:30 GMT 3
Idle young men will always seek refuge in groups or gangs they perceive to be powerful since an idle mind is the devil's workshop. Destroy Al Shabaab and they'll have to look elsewhere. The day a legitimate threat emerges from Bungoma or Mombasa is the day consideration for building a wall may be valid. b6k, correct me if I am wrong: isn't it so, that every elite university in the USA boasts a gang --like the famous skulls n bones, to which all the Yale honchos you know belonged? Both Potus Bushes, Secretary of state John Kerry, Clinton etc. And i remember from a recent scandal, some of them are whites only , with chanting rituals like it's white honour to kill a nigga! Now. Why pick on crips n bloods of LA, or the Latino MS 13 - Mara salvatruca, as the devil's workshops? Boys will be boys! Why do do elite kids join campus gangs? Themselves no less seedy? Psychology! Hoaaa! |
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Post by b6k on Apr 17, 2015 5:49:52 GMT 3
How astute of you, Jakaswanga, to throw in Skulls & Bones into the mix. Bill Clinton was a Georgetown University man so I doubt he was Skulls & Bones which is very much a Yale thing.
For what it's worth those elite university gangs do not go around killing people like the Chips & the Bloods or Al Shabaab do. They save their killing for much later...once they have assumed political office.
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Post by mank on Apr 18, 2015 5:42:50 GMT 3
I find the building of a fence along the border rather interesting. Why didn't somebody think about that in 1978? Or is that how we got to contain Shifta? How high is the fence going to be, I wonder? I hope it will touch the sky, or it won't work!
And how firm, by the way? Not many months ago we witnessed the felling of a brick wall by a gang of primary school kids. I hope that fence will be stronger than anything I can imagine ... or its a waste of my mother's money.
And please tell me that the Karau won't be allowing 'illegals' through panya roots, and the main entrance alike, for "something small" even while the fence stands. I am wasting hopes - I know!
I have a better solution. Kenyans should get hell-angry, and hit back at the terrorists... don't misunderstand me. I am not asking Kenyans to face-off with Alshabaab ... not yet. The immediate terrorist is alshamus - that officer taking a bribe, and that politician in corruption. And you, who finds it quite okay to get what is not yours at the price of "kitu kidogo," paid in a dark corner.
I think instead of building a fence we should put you and your corrupt cop and politician in a container and make you disappear ... it would be surprisingly easy to keep alshabaab at a distance if we didn't have you facilitating their missions for kitu kidogo. You wretched trash.
... and please, wananchi.... when a utumishi kwa wote plane that is supposed to be on standby for use in case of an emergency is unavailable in an emmergency because it is flying a family of a government officer somewhere for a nice treat, it is irresponsible of us not to get angry! Most civic progress is founded on the anger of the common person.
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