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Post by mank on Aug 14, 2014 5:13:26 GMT 3
Police in full combat gear, loaded weapons trained at peaceful demonstrators
This is happening in a US city where a policeman shot dead a black teenager on the street, allegedly while the teen had his hands in the air in surrender. This conflict between demonstrators and the police has been going on for days. It is very strange to see policemen on top of combat vehicles with heavy fully loaded guns pointed at civilians. I post this as information that challenges some of the simplistic positions many of us Kenyans take when something (often not even) as barbaric as this happens in Kenya. How often have you seen a statement "only in Kenya", "Africans ....", "that is why Africa ...", or "that tribe using state might against the people." Ok folks. I thought this is worth a place on Jukwaa for reflection.
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Post by jakaswanga on Aug 14, 2014 18:47:17 GMT 3
Mank wrote: Amigo! that is not what I am seeing! --which picture do you think I am looking at!?
I am told Ferguson is 63% black but the police force is over 95% white. Is that not as hot as Sunni :-XShiite in Iraq now? --If that crowd were white Mank, I do not believe the Rambo pose would cut! --Do you know the official police psychological profile of a ''black mob'' in the USA, which then determinse the rules of engagement!?
if you did, I doubt you would use the word civilian on them!
between the police radio reporting suspect is a BLACK MALE, and suspect is a white male, there is a world apart of conveyed meaning!
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Post by mank on Aug 15, 2014 5:58:37 GMT 3
Mank wrote: Amigo! that is not what I am seeing! --which picture do you think I am looking at!? Brother Jakaswanga, believe me there are other pictures before the Rambo pose . But I can't blame you for seeing only the last one ... there's something about it. I am told Ferguson is 63% black but the police force is over 95% white. Is that not as hot as Sunni :-XShiite in Iraq now? --If that crowd were white Mank, I do not believe the Rambo pose would cut! --Do you know the official police psychological profile of a ''black mob'' in the USA, which then determinse the rules of engagement!? if you did, I doubt you would use the word civilian on them! between the police radio reporting suspect is a BLACK MALE, and suspect is a white male, there is a world apart of conveyed meaning! From what I hear about that place both 63% and 95% are underestimates. Nation has more pictures here: www.nation.co.ke/photo/-/1951220/2418548/-/d0xufc/-/index.html
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Post by mank on Aug 16, 2014 8:16:10 GMT 3
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Post by b6k on Aug 16, 2014 8:42:01 GMT 3
Jakaswanga, I noted the same thing you spotted the day I saw the line of heavily armed cops staring down the Fergusonians. Information is now coming out that the 18 year old who was killed by cop had robbed (technically shoplifted as he was unarmed) some convenient store minutes before. Granted he was stopped for jaywalking with a pal & not the robbery, the $50 worth of items he swiped were found on his body. Seems like he may have taken to his heels while his pal was being arrested so he wouldn't be linked to the shoplifting incident. The cop who shot him (excessive force to make up for inability to run after suspect) was young at 28. Case of testosterone gone rogue on both sides, with a hint of the race thing. www.bostonglobe.com/news/nation/2014/08/15/ferguson-shooting-victim-was-robbery-suspect-police-say/EnZ3K8bZjMpuhgU18ZlGFN/story.html
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Post by jakaswanga on Aug 16, 2014 9:55:03 GMT 3
Mank, at Ferguson, Missiouri, amigo what did you do? You look like you are simply going around the corner to the barbecue at the park where nyamchoms is the weekend gig! But it is like you are a member of the ANC local club and the Apartheid police of South Africa, under the Bothas and the Vosters, do not like you taking a stroll on the streets of Cape Town!--see photo! And you Rambos tear-gassed your own senator Maria Chappelle-Nadal! O Mank! You gringos are bad-a$$! You host African dictators a White Houseball, but tear-gas your own senators supporting her people!? and then you want to export democracy to Russia and Angola! NB: When the NYPD –-of the Great Satan-- cleared Zuccotti park of Occupy Protesters in November 2011 caught in some of these illustrative #bashtag photos … Ahmedinejad of –-evil axis-- Iran whose streets had once been a battlefield after his controversial re-election tweeted, look who is calling the kettle black!
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Post by jakaswanga on Aug 16, 2014 9:58:06 GMT 3
Jakaswanga, I noted the same thing you spotted the day I saw the line of heavily armed cops staring down the Fergusonians. Information is now coming out that the 18 year old who was killed by cop had robbed (technically shoplifted as he was unarmed) some convenient store minutes before. Granted he was stopped for jaywalking with a pal & not the robbery, the $50 worth of items he swiped were found on his body. Seems like he may have taken to his heels while his pal was being arrested so he wouldn't be linked to the shoplifting incident. T he cop who shot him (excessive force to make up for inability to run after suspect) was young at 28. Case of testosterone gone rogue on both sides, with a hint of the race thing.www.bostonglobe.com/news/nation/2014/08/15/ferguson-shooting-victim-was-robbery-suspect-police-say/EnZ3K8bZjMpuhgU18ZlGFN/story.html at 28 young, a male cop manifested an inability to chase and run down a lumbering suspect! Hehe b6k! there is comedy in tragedy after all!
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Post by mank on Aug 16, 2014 20:28:31 GMT 3
Mank, at Ferguson, Missiouri, amigo what did you do? You look like you are simply going around the corner to the barbecue at the park where nyamchoms is the weekend gig! But it is like you are a member of the ANC local club and the Apartheid police of South Africa, under the Bothas and the Vosters, do not like you taking a stroll on the streets of Cape Town!--see photo! And you Rambos tear-gassed your own senator Maria Chappelle-Nadal! O Mank! You gringos are bad-a$$! You host African dictators a White Houseball, but tear-gas your own senators supporting her people!? and then you want to export democracy to Russia and Angola! Bwaha ha ha ... I think that's when I was checking what part of "hands up, don't shoot" the gun goons don't understand! I am listening to Maria's venting right now. I don't know what may go down when she meets the police chief somewhere in that little Ferguson. She's pissed ... got tear-gassed twice, and the police releases the picture of Brown stealing cancer sticks and not a picture of the murderer karau! She makes a great point, that the time police need to address is the time of Brown and the cop interacted ... not the time the police chief so shameless wants the public to focus on. Amigo, just because we host someone at white house doesn't mean we cant be interested in putting the same person in the receiving end that we put Gaddaffi --- remember what we did with that one?
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Post by b6k on Aug 19, 2014 12:03:06 GMT 3
Oops! Jakaswanga it looks like the cop was telling the truth all along. Video evidence is now out showing Brown committing a "strong arm" robbery earlier. When he was later confronted by the cop since Mike and his pal matched suspects descriptions, things got deadly. The autopsy report reveals all of Brown's wounds were on his front side, not the back. It's highly likely he was charging ("bumrushing") the officer who was much smaller than Brown. www.brennerbrief.com/witness-michael-brown-bum-rushed-cop/
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Post by mank on Aug 22, 2014 15:40:34 GMT 3
Oops! Jakaswanga it looks like the cop was telling the truth all along. Video evidence is now out showing Brown committing a "strong arm" robbery earlier. When he was later confronted by the cop since Mike and his pal matched suspects descriptions, things got deadly. The autopsy report reveals all of Brown's wounds were on his front side, not the back. It's highly likely he was charging ("bumrushing") the officer who was much smaller than Brown. www.brennerbrief.com/witness-michael-brown-bum-rushed-cop/I think his friend was the first to talk about that incident. The incident was not connected with the shooting, although the cops want to explain everything around it. There have been several eye witnesses, all whom talk of some sort of struggled at the car, then Brown frees himself, runs away, but is pursued and short multiple times till he dies. One female witness who seems to have been closest to the scene describes the struggle at the car as an attempt by Brown to pull away. That corroborates what Brown' s friend said ... that the cop had reversed his car and grabbed Brown through the window. This part of events is the only part of eye witness narratives that differ a bit, but the difference is clearly related with the vantage point from which the witnesses saw the event - unfortunately those who were not close enough to see exactly what was going on are quick to call it an 'altercation', but when grilled they reveal that they assumed so it was when they saw movements at the window. Narratives actually make it clear that when the guy was short in the head he was already falling down at a distance, succumbing to all those other shorts before. The kid was never a danger to the gun man.
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Post by jakaswanga on Aug 22, 2014 20:32:34 GMT 3
Oops! Jakaswanga it looks like the cop was telling the truth all along. Video evidence is now out showing Brown committing a "strong arm" robbery earlier. When he was later confronted by the cop since Mike and his pal matched suspects descriptions, things got deadly. The autopsy report reveals all of Brown's wounds were on his front side, not the back. It's highly likely he was charging ("bumrushing") the officer who was much smaller than Brown. www.brennerbrief.com/witness-michael-brown-bum-rushed-cop/I think his friend was the first to talk about that incident. The incident was not connected with the shooting, although the cops want to explain everything around it. There have been several eye witnesses, all whom talk of some sort of struggled at the car, then Brown frees himself, runs away, but is pursued and short multiple times till he dies. One female witness who describes the struggle at the car as an attempt by Brown to pull away. That corroborates what Brown said ... that the cop had reversed his car and grabbed Brown through the window. This part of events is the only part of eye witness narratives that differ a bit, but the difference is clearly related with the vantage point from which the witnesses saw the event - unfortunately those who were not close enough to see exactly what was going on are quick to call it an 'altercation', but when grilled they reveal that they assumed so it was when they saw movements at the window. Narratives actually make it clear that when the guy was short in the head he was already falling down at a distance, succumbing to all those other shorts before. The kid was never a danger to the gun man. here is another interesting aspect to the story. www.democracynow.org/2014/8/12/the_killing_of_michael_brown_missouri
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Post by mank on Aug 22, 2014 22:19:30 GMT 3
I think his friend was the first to talk about that incident. The incident was not connected with the shooting, although the cops want to explain everything around it. There have been several eye witnesses, all whom talk of some sort of struggled at the car, then Brown frees himself, runs away, but is pursued and short multiple times till he dies. One female witness who describes the struggle at the car as an attempt by Brown to pull away. That corroborates what Brown said ... that the cop had reversed his car and grabbed Brown through the window. This part of events is the only part of eye witness narratives that differ a bit, but the difference is clearly related with the vantage point from which the witnesses saw the event - unfortunately those who were not close enough to see exactly what was going on are quick to call it an 'altercation', but when grilled they reveal that they assumed so it was when they saw movements at the window. Narratives actually make it clear that when the guy was short in the head he was already falling down at a distance, succumbing to all those other shorts before. The kid was never a danger to the gun man. here is another interesting aspect to the story. www.democracynow.org/2014/8/12/the_killing_of_michael_brown_missouriYeah, that's the friend. His narrative is corroborated by all eye witnesses, with the minor differences on what exactly was the struggle through the window of the car. Meanwhile the cops story is untold, except if you assume hearsay by people around him is hos story .... that he was badly injured by Brown and feared for his life. I have always thought that when you have a gun in your hands you need a very persuasive threat to legally kill someone who does not have a similar weapon - especially when you have been trained to use the weapon. I have seen a cop pock the head of a robber in thick pedestrian traffic on Luthuli avenue ... you would think if a cop can be so confident and precise, then even when threatened a cop can shoot with the aim to immobilize. But no ... even their noses argue that it is too risky. That is the case of the other black man that was shot dead not far from Ferguson, because he had a gun ... damn it, the cops had been informed that he had a gun and was behaving erratically, and all they can do is actually kill him when he invites them to do so!
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Post by b6k on Aug 24, 2014 10:50:05 GMT 3
Mank, being a black male in a white man's country is an occupational hazard. I got out of Dodge during the Rodney King riots and have never looked back. A life led as though one is constantly walking on eggshells lest you "offend" someone isn't something I was comfortable to do. So sadly, when in Rome toe the line as choices, even as minor as jaywalking, have consequences...
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Post by jakaswanga on Aug 25, 2014 21:42:11 GMT 3
Mank, being a black male in a white man's country is an occupational hazard. I got out of Dodge during the Rodney King riots and have never looked back. A life led as though one is constantly walking on eggshells lest you "offend" someone isn't something I was comfortable to do. So sadly, when in Rome toe the line as choices, even as minor as jaywalking, have consequences... The number of bullets white cops pump into unarmed black males tells a tale. The Senegalese man who only had a can of coke in his hands in New York got more than 33 bullets! this Brown guy in Ferguson Missouri recieved six, with two in the head. I assume the cop ran out of bullets! --it is called a frenzy. Fire until you run out of ammo! --like in the movies. Howeve in real life if you do that, it simply means you have gone beserk. And that is sign of mental instability. Black males apparently do precipitate epileptic-insult-like activities in the brains of white cops, turning them into killer cops! Indeed b6k, there is nothing more dangerous to the life of a confident black male in America than a white cop with a gun, licensed to kill!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 26, 2014 1:56:22 GMT 3
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Post by b6k on Aug 26, 2014 23:26:46 GMT 3
KK, extra judicial killings happen all the time in the US as Michael Brown's case proves. The difference is only in the terminology as EJK, at least in the US context, is reserved for murders that take place against foreigners (or the odd American citizen) on foreign soil while those that occur in the US are brushed under the rug as cases of excessive force (remember the immigrant Muslim guy who was shot dead by an FBI agent after the Boston bombings whilst unarmed and in custody?). So it's just a semantics thing, not a "value" thing or lack thereof. However since you brought this whole "police overstepping their mandate" thing home to KE, try to watch this week's Jicho Pevu/The Inside Story that aired on KTN this last Sunday & Monday night on the Lamu killings. Towards the end of part two they compared the national outcry and support that followed the shooting (in the head) injury of baby Osinya in Likoni and the plight of a 4 year old Muslim boy on the night businessman Bhatt was gunned down. Baby Osinya survived brain surgery to remove the bullet that was lodged in his skull (the same bullet that killed his mother) whilst the Muslim boy had his leg amputated after allegedly being shot, in the leg as was his uncle, by cops. Why do I bring this up? KTN claimed Mombasa police boss Nelson Marwa apologized for the accidental shooting under the radar as he took a bank slip confirming payment to the boy's mother (via the area chief) of 500,000 KES from ICC war crimes indictee, William Samoei Ruto. Not a cent came from the same Kenyan do-gooders who supported baby Osinya, nor governor Joho who had pledged 1 million KES for the lad's upkeep. So yes, life is cheap for "black bodies" in KE but it can also be interesting as succor can come from the most unlikely quarters....
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Post by mank on Aug 27, 2014 0:46:35 GMT 3
Mank, being a black male in a white man's country is an occupational hazard. I got out of Dodge during the Rodney King riots and have never looked back. A life led as though one is constantly walking on eggshells lest you "offend" someone isn't something I was comfortable to do. So sadly, when in Rome toe the line as choices, even as minor as jaywalking, have consequences... You did right braatha! For some of us though, its a life assessment of the real value in "ukishikwa shikamana."
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Post by podp on Aug 27, 2014 15:31:15 GMT 3
Mank, being a black male in a white man's country is an occupational hazard. I got out of Dodge during the Rodney King riots and have never looked back. A life led as though one is constantly walking on eggshells lest you "offend" someone isn't something I was comfortable to do. So sadly, when in Rome toe the line as choices, even as minor as jaywalking, have consequences... You did right braatha! For some of us though, its a life assessment of the real value in "ukishikwa shikamana." red high light one very bright Kenyan student won an equivalent of 'green card' that the Germans were yet to ratify almost 10 years ago. while visiting him after he had completed the mandatory 6 months of language and culture course he was so low. kiss na manna. on telly the local equivalent of governor or senator was arguing and urging his supporters that 'green card' was a bad, very bad idea, but if ever it was given the lowest race to be considered should be the Indians never, and like our local politicians say 'over my dead body' if Africans and those Black ones were to be considered! so I could empathize with this hopeful bright Kenyan ICT student who had won a scholarship but was not welcome to settle in Germany. back to topic at hand and closer home one commentator had this to say And lobbying tear gas and stern grenades at the same time. As I said and I'll continue saying, most of our cops happen to be in the wrong profession. from the story below Authorities bowed to mounting public outrage to announce they had opened investigations into the murder of the minor shot by eight policemen during a raid on their home in Kinango, Kwale County. The Independent Policing Oversight Authority ( IPOA) opened an investigation into the Friday shooting and announced that its officials recovered two live bullets and a spent cartridge from the scene. "We have launched a preliminary investigation into the matter and we have recovered two bullets and one spent bullet casing," Gladys Some, a spokeswoman for IPOA, told The Standard last evening. Read more at: www.standardmedia.co.ke/thecounties/article/2000132644/outrage-over-14-year-old-girl-shot-dead-by-policemen-in-kwaleresulting in "The police service will not protect a killer in its ranks. When we get to the bottom of this matter, those who took part in this killing must be punished according to the law," Kitur warned. Read more at: www.standardmedia.co.ke/thecounties/article/2000132846/probe-into-killing-of-14-year-old-girl-in-kwale-launched
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2014 1:51:45 GMT 3
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