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Post by nowayhaha on Mar 27, 2012 12:30:45 GMT 3
Is itot strange how Mutula suddenly becomes an important person on the constitution but the moment he is seen as a Kalonzo lieutenant and at that time becomes the enemy of the people.....! As regards Job's comment about lack of depth, has he looked at what lies in ODM...Replacing Professor Simbili with who? Very well said Bwana Kamale . Sample below some few comments from some Jukwaaist on the outgoing Minister for Justice Mutula Kilonzo A few things.The reality here is that the forces that are opposed to any kind of reforms, particularly in the police force, the judiciary and even constitutional reforms have won temporarily. Kibaki is most likely going to appoint Kilonzo to the that ministry. Kilonzo and reforms have never met anywhere, so if Kibaki was to appoint Kilonzo it would be a clear signal to Kenyans that the reform agenda is dead. As we speak the cartel must already be making their moves. I am sure Kibaki is not doing much in Zambia other than sleeping and talking to members of the cartel on their next move. Under the present circumstances, there will be no police reforms, there will be no land reforms and all those other institutional reforms, but even the Kibaki cartel cannot stop Kenyans from getting a new constitution. That is where the battle is headed. Even if they bring Kilonzo to work for the cartel in justice docket they can still be overun if the ODM and like minded entities mobilize a force in parliament. I think we also have to acknowledge that Martha Karua despite all her past problems had established a very good rapport with the human rights and civil society groups. That is now cut off. Kilonzo or whoever takes up that office will not link up with those key stakeholders. adongo Probably the hardliners will push for Githae's appointment if not Murungi returning to the docket. I am sure Kalooser will want an anti-reform agent like Mutula in the docket. Kenya is rife for a revolution but no man is courageous enough to impregnate the nation now. IS THIS GUY FOR REAL OR A JOKE? I GUESS NAIVASHA TEAM DIDN'T GET AWAY WITH MUTILATING THE CONSTITUTION ENOUGH .THE PEOPLE OF KENYA GAVE THEIR VIEWS TO "COE" AND IT REDEEMED IT SELF. "PSC" CONTROLLED BY KIBAKI PNU TRIED TO MESS AND WAS ENGAGED IN THE MUTILATION OF THE DRAFT CONSTITUTION...
KENYANS ARE GOING TO VOTE YES TO THE REFERENDUM WITH THE CONSTITUTION AS IS .. WHEN WILL KIBAKI & CO LEARN THAT KENYA INA WENYEWE???
WHAT A JOKER? DOES HE TAKE KENYANS FOR FOOLS?? This selfish political opportunist depicts exactly why Kenya remains retrogressive. Why wait like a vulture, capitalizing on tough government decisions that seek to save the country from desertification, at the alter of me-myself-and-I politics? Then just listen to Mutula Kilonzo engaging in doublespeak? How pathetic has our nation become? Ladies and Gentlemen, this looks more like a consortium of old KANU land grabbers who are basically the cause why landless folks are pushed into State forests in the first place. I wanted to see real philanthropists donating title deeds to swathes of land idly held in the RVP. The culprits are known to us all. A friend of mine was killed in Mutula Kilonzo's land at Salgaa. He is a landgrabber. Uhuru Kenyatta, William Ruto, Frankline Bett, Yusuf Haji. Name someone who was prominently there, I will show you a shameless landgrabber, the same idiots who put Kenyans out in the cold and then run around like deranged bulls. God save us from these scums. -Kaburwo- adongo kilonzo is an interesting minister without going to his activities before he was appointed to the cabinet and just focusing on his cabinet performance what we see is a publicity stuntsman first as metropolitan minister - i think he was in the papers daily with grandiose plans to rehabilitate nairobi, with helipads, modern highways, apartment complexes to replace slums and what nots etc. i think he asked for a 10b or 80b dont remember the number and promised to turn around nairobi in 1 or 2 years. then he got to justice and promised new constitution in 1 year and a raft of other goodies. he also insisted that his STK bill would be an earth shattering instrument and break new grounds. we are now in the third year of the administration, nairobi is what it was. the new metro minister i even forget his name is he still there, i think mutua has done more with the pebbles project. we now have a limping draft constitution (of which he has no direct input yet and has been more of a passenger riding on previous inputs from karua and others), no stk etc. = hot air. i have not seen anything as yet that can directly be attributed directly to him but i could be wrong. on the ICC he blows hot then cold. this is the guy when he calls a baraza you schedule it for last and finish up any other jobs you had and then attend for the entertainment value. very refreshing when going into a weekend. not the kind of stuff you want at the beginning of a work week.
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Post by nereah on Mar 27, 2012 12:38:38 GMT 3
either agwambo is setting up kibaki with his concurrence to the cabinet shake-up or he has been outwitted,something that his handlers especially lawyer paul mwangi should be busy on.
please allow me to raise this explosive issue in another thread so that i don't derail or destruct the brilliant discussions here.
next!
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Post by adongo23456 on Mar 27, 2012 15:46:11 GMT 3
Folks,
The one thing that comes through very clearly in this reshuffle is that Kibaki is a very reckless person and may still gamble with the country like he did in 2005 and 2007 if that is what he percieves to be good for him.
Picking Wamalwa, a person who probably has never set foot in a law court to represent even a chicken thief as the new minister for justice and constitutional affairs is grossly unfair to the country and to Wamalwa himself. The idea that Wamalwa can help Uhuru with the ICC is nonsense. There is nothing Wamalwa can do for him there.
Wamalwa has been given a flag for purposes of looking like somebody for the sake of Uhuru but he cannot handle the dire demands of the ministry of constitutional affairs with less than a year left to plug in key pieces in the constitution implementation. Wamalwa will remain the toy that he is and I suspect Githu Muigai will double up as the AG and the minister for constitutional affairs. We will address that later.
For now, my take is that the Uhuru forces are unable to think through the ICC quagmire and are beating about the bush. Don't be surprised if they do even more reckless things. Even the option of Uhuru and co turning into international fugitives is on the table and so may be an attempt to arrest Uhuru and co now, charge them with mass murder in Kenya and hope that the ICC can allow Kenya to take up the case under "exceptional circumstances" and then try to fool around later. Each of those options is riddled with infinite complications. That is how terrible this whole ICC thing is. For the first time some people are feeling truly helpless. It is a very strange feeling for them. That is their problem.
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Post by mwalimumkuu on Mar 27, 2012 15:54:10 GMT 3
either agwambo is setting up kibaki with his concurrence to the cabinet shake-up or he has been outwitted,something that his handlers especially lawyer paul mwangi should be busy on.
please allow me to raise this explosive issue in another thread so that i don't derail or destruct the brilliant discussions here.
next!Nereah, Agwambo has either run out of options or is just sleeping on the job. How Kibaki can run rings around him in this manner is just surprising to say the least.
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Post by phil on Mar 27, 2012 16:08:08 GMT 3
More cabinet reshuffling:
Hon Hassan Ali Joho:Asst. Minister for Transport Hon Simon Ogari:Asst. Minister for Information and Communications Hon. Dhadho G. Godhana : Assistant Minister for Livestock Development.
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Post by OtishOtish on Mar 27, 2012 16:16:13 GMT 3
either agwambo is setting up kibaki with his concurrence to the cabinet shake-up or he has been outwitted,something that his handlers especially lawyer paul mwangi should be busy on.
please allow me to raise this explosive issue in another thread so that i don't derail or destruct the brilliant discussions here.
next!Raila knows that these new guys will be there for less that a year and Kibaki has chosen people who give political mileage but who can only make things worse for those Kibaki supports. In Raila's shoes, I would not fight Kibaki on this one.
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Post by kamalet on Mar 27, 2012 17:10:47 GMT 3
either agwambo is setting up kibaki with his concurrence to the cabinet shake-up or he has been outwitted,something that his handlers especially lawyer paul mwangi should be busy on.
please allow me to raise this explosive issue in another thread so that i don't derail or destruct the brilliant discussions here.
next!...where is that new thread?
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Post by beamer on Mar 27, 2012 17:31:30 GMT 3
Picking Wamalwa, a person who probably has never set foot in a law court to represent even a chicken thief as the new minister for justice and constitutional affairs is grossly unfair to the country and to Wamalwa himself. Wasn't Eugene among the lawyers who represented President Museveni in the Election Petition of 2001 filed by Besigye along with Dr Khaminwa and the Ugandan lawyer Dr Byamugisha as Lead Counsel? Still strange that he is now Justice Minister. Cant wait for Cabinet Secretaries next year!
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Post by tnk on Mar 27, 2012 17:38:14 GMT 3
nowayhahayou're right, i will speak for myself and a few others that may share my views right up to some time last year (just about the time ICC cases picked up and shuttle diplomacy began), mutula kilonzo was a little bit of a character. could not take him seriously on any issue and he tended to speak louder than any action. and then suddenly just like that he turned dead serious on implementing the constitution (took on the ICC issue critically and seriously) and in his own words started fighting impunity we were still skeptical but as you can see from this thread, we were amazed at his steadfastness, sample thread below, there are others around the failed shuttle diplomacy jukwaa.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=6499&page=1what you need to bear in mind is that Kibaki has had 3 Min. of Justice and is now working on the fourth the 1st was forced out/stepped down due to corruption (entrenching impunity - my words) the 2nd quit, citing (in her own words) interference from forces of impunity the 3rd has been fired or replaced for fighting forces of impunity (in his own words) the 4th is in (ostensibly because he is in bed with the forces of impunity - my words) so if you are keeping a scorecard, please note that merchants of impunity on kibaki side have hounded out two able ministers of justice for standing up for justice, while kenyans have hounded out one minister of justice due to corruption. beware the ministry of justice, national cohesion, constitutional affairs (and impunity) check out outgoing message to incoming www.youtube.com/share_popup?v=UvsshY_ZE9U
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Post by mzee on Mar 27, 2012 17:53:35 GMT 3
Tnk, You nailed it buddy. That was crisp and to the point
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Post by phil on Mar 27, 2012 17:53:59 GMT 3
Spot the difference! Name Wamalwa Ludovic Eugene P105 Number P.105/2827/95 Status Inactive ABA Status Unpaid Work Place KENYA NATIONAL ASSEMBLY Physical Address PARLIAMENT BLDG., PARLIAMENT ROAD Postal Address 41842-00100 Town NAIROBI
online.lsk.or.ke/online/listasmore.php?avs=6692
======
Name Mutula Kilonzo P105 Number P.105/752/75 Status Active ABA Status Life Work Place KILONZO & CO. ADVOCATES Physical Address KAY GROUP CENTRE, NGONG RD. Postal Address 59839-00200 Town NAIROBI
online.lsk.or.ke/online/listasmore.php?avs=2572
=====
Active: The advocate is certified to practice for the year 2012.
Inactive: The advocate is not certified to practice for the year 2012.
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Post by nereah on Mar 27, 2012 17:58:49 GMT 3
either agwambo is setting up kibaki with his concurrence to the cabinet shake-up or he has been outwitted,something that his handlers especially lawyer paul mwangi should be busy on.
please allow me to raise this explosive issue in another thread so that i don't derail or destruct the brilliant discussions here.
next!Nereah, Agwambo has either run out of options or is just sleeping on the job. How Kibaki can run rings around him in this manner is just surprising to say the least. in managing the coalition affairs, history teaches us that whenever kibaki,flexes his muscles as is the case now, the agwambo wing of the coalition makes the best of it and emerges much stronger.
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Post by nereah on Mar 27, 2012 18:03:43 GMT 3
either agwambo is setting up kibaki with his concurrence to the cabinet shake-up or he has been outwitted,something that his handlers especially lawyer paul mwangi should be busy on.
please allow me to raise this explosive issue in another thread so that i don't derail or destruct the brilliant discussions here.
next!Raila knows that these new guys will be there for less that a year and Kibaki has chosen people who give political mileage but who can only make things worse for those Kibaki supports. In Raila's shoes, I would not fight Kibaki on this one. or better still, it helps widens the ideological fault lines(progressives versus status quoists) for the betterment of discerning voters and kenyans who are waiting anytime soon to exercise their democratic rights.
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Post by nereah on Mar 27, 2012 18:04:48 GMT 3
either agwambo is setting up kibaki with his concurrence to the cabinet shake-up or he has been outwitted,something that his handlers especially lawyer paul mwangi should be busy on.
please allow me to raise this explosive issue in another thread so that i don't derail or destruct the brilliant discussions here.
next!...where is that new thread? its right there.....over your shoulder
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Post by nereah on Mar 27, 2012 18:29:00 GMT 3
well folks,
kibaki and his handlers have made a statement that in my view set kenya in a long haul of politicking.
with ongeri of nyanza and eugene of populous bukusu community, kibaki's handlers lays bare their political game plan of his succession.
not a game changer if you ask me as it exposes the pnu side of the coalition more than it seeks to undermine and or destroy odm political strongholds in nyanza and western kenya.
it must be emphasized here that all ministries are equal contrary to the much peddles notion. i would be glad to learn from any contrarian view of a cabinet minister who earns more than his fellow ministers.
all i know is that ministries like the one mutula kilonzo is taking over have bigger budgets.noah wekesa's forestry ministry is just as important to my mother in gem who is fighting with rouge monkeys as that of saitoti.
the thinking of the presidents men is clearly obvious with this reshuffles and expects grumbles from the likes of mwangi the kiunjuri who believe eugene slots belongs to central.
kibaki and his men are yet to learn from the experiment they had with musikari kombo whom kibaki elevated from assistant minister to full minister to buttress his standing as presumptive heir of kijana wamalwa. kombo did take over ford-kenya but what else can kenyans remember him for besides the one dangerous man phrase and destroying the party jaramogi founded?
eugene is now being propped as alternative centre of power in luhya and bukusus sub-tribe and jukwaa pedants ;D like political maniac ,mukwasi,akhunyanye and omundi would agree with me that bukusus knows better than being divided.
i submit that weta or mose as wetangula is known has now more time to domesticate himself and given his advantage as a strategic nairobi insider(see how he survived all this time long since the moi days as nominated mp) and resources(arguably the most affluent mps in luhya land today)remains the best hope for bukusus in national politics.
on the odm side, i see agwambo more circumspect given that he has not touched henry kosgey's presumed slot of industrialization ministry.latest shuffling of his deck where he has slotted in joho in the assistant ministry post are to me more of diversionary than real politik.
i am convinced that odm has its game plan premised on a new beginning and therefore anything else is presumptuous and must be treated so.
my pesa nane.
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Post by adongo23456 on Mar 27, 2012 18:40:05 GMT 3
Picking Wamalwa, a person who probably has never set foot in a law court to represent even a chicken thief as the new minister for justice and constitutional affairs is grossly unfair to the country and to Wamalwa himself. Wasn't Eugene among the lawyers who represented President Museveni in the Election Petition of 2001 filed by Besigye along with Dr Khaminwa and the Ugandan lawyer Dr Byamugisha as Lead Counsel? Still strange that he is now Justice Minister. Cant wait for Cabinet Secretaries next year! hehehehehehehe. May be he represented that other chicken thief in some mythical court as a clerical court worker. Eugene Wamalwa cannot practice law anywhere even in Zamunda. He is not a legal scholar either. I doubt he is an advocate of the High Court of Kenya. It is insulting to the whole country to have someone with this scanty knowledge of the law as the minister charged with the duty if implementing a new constitution with huge stakes for the country and even for Kibaki. This is a reckless deriliction of duty by Kibaki just for his political toys. Well this is not the first time Kibaki has done this sort of thing. In the run up to the 2007 General Electiosn Kibaki stubbornly picked his ECK fixers including his own lawyer to go fix the election for him. Everybody knew Kibaki was going to rig the elections. We saw AP cops being transported in the hot spots. People knew something sinister was about to happen but Kenyans being who we are (optimisitc people) still thought Kibaki would not dare do something so outrageous as to threaten the country. Well he did just that and then some. It took Kofi Annan and others to pull the country back to its senses even as the same Kibaki supporters we see shouting here now were still cheering his treachery as an act of brilliance. So we know Kibaki is capable of destroying that country for his own good. Will he try it again. It seems he is getting ready to do just that. We will see how that goes down.
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Post by destiny on Mar 27, 2012 18:47:02 GMT 3
More cabinet reshuffling: Hon Hassan Ali Joho:Asst. Minister for Transport Hon Simon Ogari:Asst. Minister for Information and Communications Hon. Dhadho G. Godhana : Assistant Minister for Livestock Development. What is it with Transport ministry and those mentioned in drug dossier? First it was Mwau AKA The Boss and now we have another dodgy character who will have the port of Mombasa under his thumb. Is someone trying to pull my leg? We may be having a spanking new constitution but the same shadowy and slippery characters are still lurking around and calling the shots from sensitive dockets. Kimunya who is Trade supremo isn't clean either after so many dodgy deals from Grand Regency to De La Rue and like a bunch of fools we expect different results!........... Someone please pass me a sick bag!
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Post by mwalimumkuu on Mar 27, 2012 19:07:20 GMT 3
More cabinet reshuffling: Hon Hassan Ali Joho:Asst. Minister for Transport Hon Simon Ogari:Asst. Minister for Information and Communications Hon. Dhadho G. Godhana : Assistant Minister for Livestock Development. What is it with Transport ministry and those mentioned in drug dossier? First it was Mwau AKA The Boss and now we have another dodgy character who will have the port of Mombasa under his thumb. Is someone trying to pull my leg? We may be having a spanking new constitution but the same shadowy and slippery characters are still lurking around and calling the shots from sensitive dockets. You must have missed yesterday's lecture about depth on one side of the coalition.
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Post by tnk on Mar 27, 2012 20:36:06 GMT 3
Tnk, You nailed it buddy. That was crisp and to the point thanks Mzee btw dont know if you listened to the video clip mutula throws eugene, one of the most brilliant curve balls ever with his parting shot - paraphrase below "good luck, with implementing the new constitution, at least you will fare better since you (eugene) are G7 while I (mutula) am not" thats just pure genius i.e those stalling the implementation are G7 and its supporters and therefore eugene should have no problem getting his buddies to support bills he introduces to the house. fasten your seat belts folks, there will be some political acrobatics in the works (speak one thing during the day and another at night) eugene will either be playing to the gallery while cooking mischief at night with the G7 or else he is about to become another G1 on the side. this might be fun
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Post by adongo23456 on Mar 27, 2012 20:41:00 GMT 3
Tnk, You nailed it buddy. That was crisp and to the point thanks Mzee btw dont know if you listened to the video clip mutula throws eugene, one of the most brilliant curve balls ever with his parting shot - paraphrase below "good luck, with implementing the new constitution, at least you will fare better since you (eugene) are G7 while I (mutula) am not" thats just pure genius i.e those stalling the implementation are G7 and its supporters and therefore eugene should have no problem getting his buddies to support bills he introduces to the house. fasten your seat belts folks, there will be some political acrobatics in the works (speak one thing during the day and another at night) eugene will either be playing to the gallery while cooking mischief at night with the G7 or else he is about to become another G1 on the side. this might be fun tnk,Those bills have to be constitutional or they will end up in court and be thrown out after long battles which will do the country no good. Eugene, Uhuru or even Kibaki himself cannot write a new constitution for Kenya. That job is done. They come with fake bills and we are stuck in court forever and the chaos will just be piling up. I don't know how that works for the G7 fantasy. These really are the kicks of a dead horse. They can't take the country backward. They will try but with very little sucess if any. The nation is going to be very ready for them and they are going to make blunders in bundles. That is what they know how to do best.
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Post by okhunyanye on Mar 27, 2012 21:29:29 GMT 3
Kathure, You are reading too much into this. It has nothing to do with homophobia. I simply reposted a picture prominently carried out in all the Kenyan local dailys during an ODM rally in Mombasa. Was the message inherent in the picture my position? Absolutely not. So why post it? Because Balala's sacking fulfills a request made in the picture by his constituents of mvita, where the rally was held. Whether or not the PM was responding to that request (almost three years on) is however beyond the wildest of my speculation. okhunyanyeIt's cheap to hit at people because of their alleged sexual orientation. Mind your own sexual orientation and stay out of other people bedrooms. Sexual orientation as does gender, race, gender identity, have nothing to do with a persons goodness or lack thereof. You didn't choose which sexual orientation you are and neither does anyone else.
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Post by tnk on Mar 27, 2012 21:35:20 GMT 3
adongo thats precisely the curve ball, eugene will either have to stall and quietly bide his time to the end of the GCG with nothing substantive to show, or else try to implement some shoddy bills favorable to G7 and in the process get fried in parliament, or try to implement the constitution and fry his buddies in the process as well as burn his own fingers
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Post by gemagema on Mar 27, 2012 21:36:30 GMT 3
Picking Wamalwa, a person who probably has never set foot in a law court to represent even a chicken thief as the new minister for justice and constitutional affairs is grossly unfair to the country and to Wamalwa himself. Wasn't Eugene among the lawyers who represented President Museveni in the Election Petition of 2001 filed by Besigye along with Dr Khaminwa and the Ugandan lawyer Dr Byamugisha as Lead Counsel? Still strange that he is now Justice Minister. Cant wait for Cabinet Secretaries next year! hehehehehehehe. May be he represented that other chicken thief in some mythical court as a clerical court worker. Eugene Wamalwa cannot practice law anywhere even in Zamunda. He is not a legal scholar either. I doubt he is an advocate of the High Court of Kenya. It is insulting to the whole country to have someone with this scanty knowledge of the law as the minister charged with the duty if implementing a new constitution with huge stakes for the country and even for Kibaki. This is a reckless deriliction of duty by Kibaki just for his political toys. Well this is not the first time Kibaki has done this sort of thing. In the run up to the 2007 General Electiosn Kibaki stubbornly picked his ECK fixers including his own lawyer to go fix the election for him. Everybody knew Kibaki was going to rig the elections. We saw AP cops being transported in the hot spots. People knew something sinister was about to happen but Kenyans being who we are (optimisitc people) still thought Kibaki would not dare do something so outrageous as to threaten the country. Well he did just that and then some. It took Kofi Annan and others to pull the country back to its senses even as the same Kibaki supporters we see shouting here now were still cheering his treachery as an act of brilliance. So we know Kibaki is capable of destroying that country for his own good. Will he try it again. It seems he is getting ready to do just that. We will see how that goes down. AdongoI can understand very well your disappointment of having Eugene as the new Justice and constitutional Minister (..am disappointed too) but it doesn't help to disparage Eugene's CV in the manner that you do. Just for your information, it is true that Eugene represented Yoweri Museveni, together with Khaminwa, when Museveni was facing a court case against his fellow presidential opponent - i think it was either Besigye or an Awori. Actually, he was more successful as a lawyer than as politician...Ok, as of yesterday, he has made some undeserving political progress. While he doesn't practice since he became a politician, His office..Wamalwa and Co. Advocates, is still operating at Corner House. And by the way, even though G7 hopes that Eugene as their point man can influence the ICC process, we have heard it very well in the News tonight that the ICC Trials cannot be stopped.
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Post by gemagema on Mar 27, 2012 21:42:19 GMT 3
kibaki and his men are yet to learn from the experiment they had with musikari kombo whom kibaki elevated from assistant minister to full minister to buttress his standing as presumptive heir of kijana wamalwa. kombo did take over ford-kenya but what else can kenyans remember him for besides the one dangerous man phrase and destroying the party jaramogi founded? eugene is now being propped as alternative centre of power in luhya and bukusus sub-tribe and jukwaa pedants ;D like political maniac ,mukwasi,akhunyanye and omundi would agree with me that bukusus knows better than being divided. i submit that weta or mose as wetangula is known has now more time to domesticate himself and given his advantage as a strategic nairobi insider(see how he survived all this time long since the moi days as nominated mp) and resources(arguably the most affluent mps in luhya land today)remains the best hope for bukusus in national politics. NereahJust for your information, very many Bukusu people do not like Weta. He is such a back stabber, even to his own blood relatives. Didnt you see how Weta ran away with the Ford Kenya party. Currently, its just a briefcase party, with meagre support..only from his fellow Eseli
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Post by omundu on Mar 28, 2012 13:14:14 GMT 3
Nereah
Eugene is very likely to win his seat back as an MP but he is of little clout in greater bukusu politics. The wamalwa name is known but that was his brother and it is but a whisper in peoples lips. Anything louder than that, well, it could be blown with the wind.
That said, it is currently very tricky to lick a finger and point it in the air to judge where the political winds are blowing in Bukusu land.
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