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Post by phil on Jun 10, 2012 15:28:15 GMT 3
President Mwai Kibaki due to address the nation on live television at 16h00 E.A.T
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bob
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Post by bob on Jun 10, 2012 15:33:28 GMT 3
I have really strange feelings about this chopper accident. This chopper was acquired I think this year and is reasonably new...so just wtf happened that it just falls off the sky 8 minutes after leaving Wilson? Like many it would be nice if sabotage would be ruled out This gentlemen had very few enemies in the political scene. May be ,just may be the chopper may not have been the real deal that the government thought it paid for considering mystery & secrecy in defense contracts in addition to wheeler dealing.
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Post by samson on Jun 10, 2012 16:17:11 GMT 3
Very sad,pole to all kenyans
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Post by nereah on Jun 10, 2012 17:03:10 GMT 3
may the almighty GOD rest the soul of joshua and george in eternal peace and give their loved ones the strength to endure and our beloved nation, kenya the grace through this sorrowful moment.here is a powerful duet by celine dione and A bocelli viewed over 4.7million times.
and liam lawton masterful piece that kept me going when death struck my cradle and altered my status in life. to the family of the two great kenyans who should have have been indoors with their loved ones this sunday but were tireless in their service to the people.
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Post by jakaswanga on Jun 10, 2012 17:34:31 GMT 3
I have to load lots of layers of hypocrisy first as mental insulatory pads, before I can verbaly express emotions I do not feel. This is why I am not a politician, since a politician must be capable of being a professional mourner, sending 'heartfelt condolences' to every news-worthy death! and putting up a convincing grave face to go with it before the tv cameras.
So I have not yet loaded enough hypocrisy to make me mourn the death of the former minister of finance under whose tenure the treasury was ripped to the bones. My heart, my honest heart, looks at the body of such a man as I look at a stray dog across my street. Cold irritation and indifference. Anybody who has stolen from the Kenyan people, with the opaque heart of a blackmamba I will stare at your body. Be damned!
The pilots and his co who were just on duty, I will share the grief of their loved ones.
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Post by kamalet on Jun 10, 2012 17:51:45 GMT 3
I have to load lots of layers of hypocrisy first as mental insulatory pads, before I can verbaly express emotions I do not feel. This is why I am not a politician, since a politician must be capable of being a professional mourner, sending 'heartfelt condolences' to every news-worthy death! and putting up a convincing grave face to go with it before the tv cameras. So I have not yet loaded enough hypocrisy to make me mourn the death of the former minister of finance under whose tenure the treasury was ripped to the bones. My heart, my honest heart, looks at the body of such a man as I look at a stray dog across my street. Cold irritation and indifference. Anybody who has stolen from the Kenyan people, with the opaque heart of a blackmamba I will stare at your body. Be damned! The pilots and his co who were just on duty, I will share the grief of their loved ones. Perhaps you might want to condole with those families left behind!
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Post by nereah on Jun 10, 2012 18:10:28 GMT 3
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Post by phil on Jun 10, 2012 18:57:10 GMT 3
courtesy of kenyan post: nereahThe above pic is not from today's chopper accident. If it was, it would be very useful to air accident investigators and of course the manufacturers of the chopper itself. The above is two years old from a totally different accident. Soma hapa sandra.visionsmartnews.com/helicopter-crash-near-meeker-co_3008.htmlIf you study the pics from the actual accident scene you will notice debris is scattered over a large area and that there is no depression on the ground at the impact site. Could this mean the chopper may have reached the ground when it was already in pieces?
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Post by moesha on Jun 10, 2012 19:22:29 GMT 3
I have really strange feelings about this chopper accident. This chopper was acquired I think this year and is reasonably new...so just wtf happened that it just falls off the sky 8 minutes after leaving Wilson? My condolences go out to the families of the bereaved. I am with the Kamalet on this issue. I too have a sick feeling about this. The choppers are some of the worlds best and my understanding is that they were also relatively new. nereahHow does the fake picture make its way to the crash photos so soon, or are we trying to cover up something already?
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Post by patriotism101 on Jun 10, 2012 19:37:23 GMT 3
The crash could have been caused by a lot of things, including pilot error/inexperience/incompetence with a new machine etc etc . So the fact that the helicopter was new is irrelevant my fellow Jukwaaist.
Why is Saitoti et al using a police chopper to go to a harambee (private function)?
When senior government officials are unable to differentiate personal from public property and they step on civil servants to do their bidding- nature has a way of taking its course.
Jakaswanga is on the money - tis a season for machozi ya mamba.
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Post by jakaswanga on Jun 10, 2012 19:39:14 GMT 3
I have to load lots of layers of hypocrisy first as mental insulatory pads, before I can verbaly express emotions I do not feel. This is why I am not a politician, since a politician must be capable of being a professional mourner, sending 'heartfelt condolences' to every news-worthy death! and putting up a convincing grave face to go with it before the tv cameras. So I have not yet loaded enough hypocrisy to make me mourn the death of the former minister of finance under whose tenure the treasury was ripped to the bones. My heart, my honest heart, looks at the body of such a man as I look at a stray dog across my street. Cold irritation and indifference. Anybody who has stolen from the Kenyan people, with the opaque heart of a blackmamba I will stare at your body. Be damned! The pilots and his co who were just on duty, I will share the grief of their loved ones. Perhaps you might want to condole with those families left behind! Yes Indeed Kamalet. With time my virulent heart will relent. And even as I think they, who consorted with state thieves, are the beneficiaries of looted monies, and are far from innocent in the legal clause of handling and having gains from stolen property, I would take a deep breath and say: condolences. And mean it.
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Post by morimax on Jun 10, 2012 19:47:46 GMT 3
My condolences to the families. May there souls rest in peace. By the way one key witness will be missing when the goldenberg case is revived.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2012 20:22:00 GMT 3
They are reporting this story on BBC Canada. I just saw Raila going to the site of the accident looking shaken.
Unlike with the blasts that have been happening in the country, he did not volunteer comments about the possible cause of the crash. He said that they do not know what caused this accident and investigations have ensued. Much better.
I'm mourning those Kenyans who die every minute because of actions and policies of people like Saitoti. Saitoti has had a cushy life that he didn't earn. At least he'll have a decent funeral and his family will be very well taken care of.
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Post by tnk on Jun 10, 2012 20:52:14 GMT 3
it is this kind of nonsense that irritates www.capitalfm.co.ke/news/2012/06/ill-fated-chopper-was-acquired-5-months-ago/== “Most probably it was caused by bad weather. It was foggy at the time it went down,” one police officer from the Kenya Police Air Wing involved in the investigation said. == so exactly how does fog bring down a plane from the air? poor visibility would then imply hitting an object, but please jamaz if you have nothing to say just let it be
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Post by tnk on Jun 10, 2012 21:01:47 GMT 3
I have to load lots of layers of hypocrisy first as mental insulatory pads, before I can verbaly express emotions I do not feel. This is why I am not a politician, since a politician must be capable of being a professional mourner, sending 'heartfelt condolences' to every news-worthy death! and putting up a convincing grave face to go with it before the tv cameras. So I have not yet loaded enough hypocrisy to make me mourn the death of the former minister of finance under whose tenure the treasury was ripped to the bones. My heart, my honest heart, looks at the body of such a man as I look at a stray dog across my street. Cold irritation and indifference. Anybody who has stolen from the Kenyan people, with the opaque heart of a blackmamba I will stare at your body. Be damned! The pilots and his co who were just on duty, I will share the grief of their loved ones. you are not alone in this blog.marsgroupkenya.org/?p=3035
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Post by reporter911 on Jun 10, 2012 22:03:12 GMT 3
I have to load lots of layers of hypocrisy first as mental insulatory pads, before I can verbaly express emotions I do not feel. This is why I am not a politician, since a politician must be capable of being a professional mourner, sending 'heartfelt condolences' to every news-worthy death! and putting up a convincing grave face to go with it before the tv cameras. So I have not yet loaded enough hypocrisy to make me mourn the death of the former minister of finance under whose tenure the treasury was ripped to the bones. My heart, my honest heart, looks at the body of such a man as I look at a stray dog across my street. Cold irritation and indifference. Anybody who has stolen from the Kenyan people, with the opaque heart of a blackmamba I will stare at your body. Be damned! The pilots and his co who were just on duty, I will share the grief of their loved ones. you are not alone in this blog.marsgroupkenya.org/?p=3035 George Muthengi Kinuthia Saitoti! Lessons from the Past – When will Kenyans learn.Hard and painful thoughts cross our minds today. In one sense We mourn all the Kenyans who perished today in the Chopper crash. 1. Captain Nancy Gituanja
2. Captain Luke Oyugi
3. Inspector Joshua Tonkei
4. Sergeant Thomas Murimi
5. Orwa Ojode
6. George Saitoti
Today. It is with great difficulty that we mourn George Saitoti as a hero (according to Kenyan mass media); because a hero, he was not. The truth in Kenya is that we forget, and we forget quickly. It was Prof. George Saitoti of the University of Nairobi Mathematics Department, who drove his VW Beetle (a well documented fact) into the Treasury Building parking lot when Daniel Arap Moi first appointed him Minister for Finance. Prof. Saitoti never looked backed, abandoning his VW Beetle motorcar for a Mercedes Benz and when he became Vice-President took on his motorcade as his chosen mode of travel. The VW Beetle motorcar was to rust in the car park— abandoned and disowned – and forgotten completely. But what irks us is that George Saitoti was the Minister of Finance in the Moi regime in the 1990s when his Ministry and Kamlesh Pattni perpetrated the Goldenberg fraud. Goldenberg cost the country over Ksh 158 billion according to a Judicial Commission of Inquiry appointed by President Kibaki in 2003. The Inquiry identified and named over a dozen individuals as perpetrators – and George Saitoti was on that list of shame.Following the Inquiry publishing its final report the Attorney General handed over the report and evidence to the Criminal Investigation Department of the Kenya Police; directing them to complete further investigations and report to him for the purposes of criminal prosecution of the perpetrators. George Saitoti went to court and controversially obtained orders expunging his name from the Inquiry Report and barring his prosecution by the Attorney General. The Attorney General immediately appealed this decision, which he declared to be unconstitutional in a strongly worded statement. The Appeal was quietly dismissed for technical reasons in 2011. Meanwhile George Saitoti’s political career proceeded smoothly and in 2008 he was promoted from the Ministry of Education to take over as Minister for Internal Security. Fortune had conspired it seems to make George Saitoti the political head of the Criminal Investigation department which the Attorney General directed to investigate him. He was now in charge of the evidence against him and the so-called Goldenberg International Limited. Were Kenyans expected to believe that Prof. Saitoti was to investigate himself or that indeed the evidence was still intact? Apparently yes! Or maybe not!Saitoti is now gone – as is Kanyotu and Riungu – but Goldenberg must not be allowed to go unpunished. Goldenberg cost Kenya 10% of its GDP. The inquiry cost Kenyan tax payers over Ksh15 million per month and ran over 2 years. Most of the culprits identified by the Bosire Commission are now dead and over Khs 158 Billion traced is now at threat of non – recovery.The 2 principals of the Grand Coalition, Mwai Kibaki and Raila Odinga, know that George Saitoti was not cleared over Goldenberg. Indeed the Prime Minister once sought to bring a private criminal prosecution against Saitoti – a charge that was quashed by Amos Wako. Political expediency being what it is, Kibaki and Odinga decided to turn a blind eye to the biggest corruption log in the eye of the Government – Goldenberg. Which begs the question why was George Saitoti such a sacred cow? And who will pay Kenyans now as both Principals lead by example in this hero worship message of impunity? Meanwhile Daniel Toroitich Arap Moi sits pretty in so-called presidential retirement. We mourn, not for George Muthengi Kinuthia Saitoti, but for his wife and Children, and all the other wonderful Kenyans who God took too soon.We still want answers and recovery of the hundreds of Billions looted from the Goldenberg Scandal. Who is the beneficiary of the stolen loot; we must not relent. And we must not glorify those who steal Kenyan funds. This is the truth, and this is a bitter pill we must chew and swallow – to get better, because as Kenyans, we suffer from a disease called Impunity. Sadly, some think the cure for this very contagious disease – is death by servant. It is not! Someone has the stolen loot. The only question is who, and, where! Let’s collect, the loot belongs to the People of Kenya.Mars Group Kenya
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Post by tnk on Jun 10, 2012 22:37:24 GMT 3
hey reporter911
thanks for the publish, but maybe i need to pen my thoughts on this issue
i think i can mourn the loss of all the six lives lost. it would be important for investigations to reveal the reasons behind the crash so that the pilots and all those concerned can move to correct whatever it was
the fact that any of these lives may have engaged in crime should not be reason enough not to mourn the loss of life. but also the mourning of the life does not take away the need to investigate and bring full closure to any crimes that they may have committed or been involved in.
thats why although i understand the position taken by MARS and jakaswanga, i just dont beleive that mourning loss of life necessarily implies sanitizing crimes. there are organs of state mandated to pursue all forms of crime whether persons involved are deceased, alive, presidential material and what not. i think we can separate the issues
i mean think of it, not to disparage anyone but am sure some of the PEV victims were maybe petty criminals or even big time thugs/gangsters, but collectively they are simply bundled as "innocent" victims of a tragic event. unless we are willing to pick out the victims one by one and then mourn each according to a scale of innocence (loud wailing) to guilt (muted wails)
while we are on hypocrisy i see a lot of people after penning some heavy hitting stuff sign off as my two cents worth
well i ain't no hypocrite (yeah i know its just an oft overused idiom but still ... )
my 3bn worth (in kenya looting has moved from cents to billions in one swoop)
but once again condolences to all those that have lost their loved ones not just in this crash but in the many events such as the mlolongo building collapse, etc
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Post by job on Jun 10, 2012 22:48:56 GMT 3
I have really strange feelings about this chopper accident. This chopper was acquired I think this year and is reasonably new...so just wtf happened that it just falls off the sky 8 minutes after leaving Wilson? You could be right. Who knows for sure! Saitoti (& Ojode) held a very crucial docket at this season of political succession; one that deals directly with - peri-electoral security, provincial administration, and ICC cooperation (enforcement of any asset freeze &/or arrest orders)...If Saitoti wasn't drinking enough Koolaid to flow along; or if in fact his personal interests were in direct competition with the big plot; angling instead to benefit from his backyard competitor's ( Muthamaki's) woes...who knows. Nevertheless, the Mars Group write-up is a very sober & significant piece to pay attention to...if Kenyans are indeed committed to fighting impunity.
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Post by mzee on Jun 10, 2012 23:24:44 GMT 3
I have really strange feelings about this chopper accident. This chopper was acquired I think this year and is reasonably new...so just wtf happened that it just falls off the sky 8 minutes after leaving Wilson? You could be right. Who knows for sure! Saitoti (& Ojode) held a very crucial docket at this season of political succession; one that deals directly with - peri-electoral security, provincial administration, and ICC cooperation (enforcement of any asset freeze &/or arrest orders)...If Saitoti wasn't drinking enough Koolaid to flow along; or if in fact his personal interests were in direct competition with the big plot; angling instead to benefit from his backyard competitor's ( Muthamaki's) woes...who knows. Nevertheless, the Mars Group write-up is a very sober & significant piece to pay attention to...if Kenyans are indeed committed to fighting impunity. Rumors doing rounds in Nairobi is that Saitoti was silenced because of his political ambition. Its said that he was bent on dividing the central province vote, that's why he was eliminated by...you know who. Ojode is said to be collateral damage.
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emali
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Post by emali on Jun 10, 2012 23:34:57 GMT 3
Condolences to the families of the bereaved the thought of their loved ones meeting such a horrific death must be very traumatic...
I won’t pretend that the nation lost a ‘great anything’ in Saitoti he would have served the nation better had he stayed at the UON.He perfected the art of sycophancy & was the true definition of an ‘experienced’ Kenyan politician, a palatable Oloo Aringo.I’m not sure even his own constituents will miss him...death was kinder and welcomed him in the same constituency where he had been rejected and reinstated by the government of the day for the last two decades...how ironic
As others have noted it the accident looks suspicious...there is a long list of people who would want him out...will it be a surprise if Lewis Nguyai becomes the new minister of internal security? Or Maybe Biwott is finishing the job with the Ouko issue & many Moi era secrets...time will tell if there is anything to the conspiracy theories...
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Post by Omwenga on Jun 10, 2012 23:35:14 GMT 3
I join the rest of those mourning the loss of both Prof. Saitoti and Hon. Ojode as well as the other passengers who perished in the chopper crash. Let's hope the government conducts a thorough and genuine investigation to determine what exactly happened if anything to assure Kenyans and the world this was nothing more than the accident we must initially assume it is. One sure way to ensure this is, indeed, the case, is for the President and Prime Minister to quickly and without any contention agree to who should replace Saitoti and Ojode in these two critical portfolios not only in the general security of our country but, more specifically, in this even more critical year of election. The ideal candidate for both positions must be someone who has proven in their deeds that they are not partisan hacks or sympathizer or cronies of anyone in politics today but a nationalist who must place Kenya first in the execution of their duties and responsibilities. I know that's asking too much of a country so consumed with the politics of succession but it must be done if we are to have a shot at avoiding even worse than we have seen before in the weeks and months to come preceding the elections or even after. Having said that, the onus is on the president to proceed in a very thoughtful manner how these appointments are made bearing in mind sometimes a leader must transcend politics and make decisions that save a nation at the expense of his or her own political interests be they party of personal political interests. I say so because there may be a temptation to say Saitoti came from the PNU wing of the coalition government therefore he must be replaced by another PNU but that thinking is wrong for several reasons: First, the government belongs to the people, not parties. While it's the law that we have shared government, the reality is, if we are all to be intellectually honest, there are certain things that never should see partisan divide of any kind and our national security is one such thing and actually the only one we all must agree it is. Second, we are still dealing with PEV and its effects. Nothing can send a stronger signal that we have learned the lessons of PEV as a nation and that we are unwilling to ever go down that dark road again than appointing a minister and assistant minister for Internal Security who everyone can agree in saying we can trust them to provide leadership in internal security free of politics or bias in favor of peace and unity. Conversely, shoving down our throats a partisan hack to head the internal security ministry would be a signal some people have not learned anything about PEV and are willing and able to lead us yet again to the dark road we must never allow ourselves to be led into. Third, moments like this ought to put the whole nation on pause and think about what's really important; is the pursuit of power and unlimited wealth worth it if your life can be snuffed and end in an instant like this or is it far more worthwhile to pursue that what makes your fellow Kenyans or human being for that matter live a better and more fulfilling life? In sum, let's use this tragic event to do that what unites us as a country not what shall further divide us or maintain status quo where maintaining power and ill-gained wealth is paramount over the welfare of our country. Naming an all-around acceptable minister and assistant minister for Internal Security followed by a crack-down on divisive politics intended to stoke up tribal animosity and paving way for an open and transparent elections would be the best way we can mourn the departed ones. May God help us in doing just that.
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Post by OtishOtish on Jun 11, 2012 0:48:42 GMT 3
Sometimes accidents just happen. Even to "big" people. Especially in a place like Kenya, where "maintenance" is an unknown word: you buy it or build it, you neglect it until it's derelict, then you buy or build another one.
Anyway, this is Kenya. By tomorrow, there will be a thousand "real truths", each one from a person who heard from his cousin who knows a person who really talked to a person who knows "why they had to be finished". They will even tell you the last spoken words as the helicopter went down. The people near the scene probably saw a "missile-like" object streaking towards the plane, mechanics at Wilson Airport saw something suspicious being loaded onto the plane, and there has to be a medicine-man somewhere, who did it all by remote. Oh, don't forget the secret mission they were on with all that cash.
Each media outlet will also have "the real story", with details obtained from "impeccable sources' and "people speaking on conditions of anonymity".
And in one month, we'll be back to the national sports: eating, tribal politics, who's ascending to State House, Raila this and that, and the like.
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bob
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Post by bob on Jun 11, 2012 1:19:34 GMT 3
I join the rest of those mourning the loss of both Prof. Saitoti and Hon. Ojode as well as the other passengers who perished in the chopper crash. Let's hope the government conducts a thorough and genuine investigation to determine what exactly happened if anything to assure Kenyans and the world this was nothing more than the accident we must initially assume it is. One sure way to ensure this is, indeed, the case, is for the President and Prime Minister to quickly and without any contention agree to who should replace Saitoti and Ojode in these two critical portfolios not only in the general security of our country but, more specifically, in this even more critical year of election. The ideal candidate for both positions must be someone who has proven in their deeds that they are not partisan hacks or sympathizer or cronies of anyone in politics today but a nationalist who must place Kenya first in the execution of their duties and responsibilities. I know that's asking too much of a country so consumed with the politics of succession but it must be done if we are to have a shot at avoiding even worse than we have seen before in the weeks and months to come preceding the elections or even after. Having said that, the onus is on the president to proceed in a very thoughtful manner how these appointments are made bearing in mind sometimes a leader must transcend politics and make decisions that save a nation at the expense of his or her own political interests be they party of personal political interests. I say so because there may be a temptation to say Saitoti came from the PNU wing of the coalition government therefore he must be replaced by another PNU but that thinking is wrong for several reasons: First, the government belongs to the people, not parties. While it's the law that we have shared government, the reality is, if we are all to be intellectually honest, there are certain things that never should see partisan divide of any kind and our national security is one such thing and actually the only one we all must agree it is. Second, we are still dealing with PEV and its effects. Nothing can send a stronger signal that we have learned the lessons of PEV as a nation and that we are unwilling to ever go down that dark road again than appointing a minister and assistant minister for Internal Security who everyone can agree in saying we can trust them to provide leadership in internal security free of politics or bias in favor of peace and unity. Conversely, shoving down our throats a partisan hack to head the internal security ministry would be a signal some people have not learned anything about PEV and are willing and able to lead us yet again to the dark road we must never allow ourselves to be led into. Third, moments like this ought to put the whole nation on pause and think about what's really important; is the pursuit of power and unlimited wealth worth it if your life can be snuffed and end in an instant like this or is it far more worthwhile to pursue that what makes your fellow Kenyans or human being for that matter live a better and more fulfilling life? In sum, let's use this tragic event to do that what unites us as a country not what shall further divide us or maintain status quo where maintaining power and ill-gained wealth is paramount over the welfare of our country. Naming an all-around acceptable minister and assistant minister for Internal Security followed by a crack-down on divisive politics intended to stoke up tribal animosity and paving way for an open and transparent elections would be the best way we can mourn the departed ones. May God help us in doing just that. OmwengaI would want to agree with you,but the reality is that you are talking of an ideal situation,which can never happen under the current leadership. The replacement more especially the late George will definitely come from the PNU wing,why do I say so? The contempt with which PNU wing have treated ODM since the arranged marriage was consummated cannot be overlooked. It has always been the belief of PNU that ODM are mere outsiders & have nothing good to offer to Kenyans. So it is my prayer that politics aside lets mourn our departed Kenyan brothers as we hope that good judgement will prevail on the part of Baba Jim to do what is right for Kenya as a whole.
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Post by amadain on Jun 11, 2012 1:45:12 GMT 3
This morning I read in your link that the helicopter "will be dedicated to police law enforcement and crime prevention missions including anti-poaching, anti-terrorism operations. It will also be deployed in search & rescue, casualty evacuation, personnel transport and various other civic protection roles." I instantly thought it was disgraceful that such a helicopter was being used to transport people to church, but decided against mentioning it on this thread in case I came across as insensitive. I've just returned now to see that some people here hold the same view as me. Good! Condolences to those involved though.
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Post by einstein on Jun 11, 2012 2:56:11 GMT 3
Good people,
Did Al-shabaab threaten Defence Minister Haji & Co. for the sole purpose of deflecting their real intention to bring Prof. Saitoti & Ojode down whom they had settled for? Remember Ojode saying in parliament that "the head of Al-shabaab is in Nairobi's Eastleigh with the tail being in Somalia"?
Sorry, I got no time to lay my hands on the article threatening Haji & Co. a while ago. Can A Jukwaaist fish it out please?
I predict: Haji will be the new Minister for Internal Security! I might be wrong though!!
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