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Post by morimax on Jan 7, 2012 22:08:00 GMT 3
OO
With due respect and without insulting your inteligence, you being the moderator, and one who holds the key to jukwaa, sometimes your reactions to other jukwaaist, moreso on matters MIGUNA MIGUNA, are quite intimidating.
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Post by morimax on Jan 7, 2012 22:15:35 GMT 3
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Post by Daktari wa makazi on Jan 7, 2012 22:22:02 GMT 3
Oloo
I have the pleasure of reading yours and Adongo's. I think you hit the nail on the head. Miguna was treated shambolically and as a consequence he is a bitter man. Is that a crime? He has right to be bitter and full of hatred. He is human, after all.
I think the problem here is not what Miguna said or did. Actually, much more worse have been said or done, previously.
The problem is that the subject matter of Miguna's outspokenness is one Raila whom people here 'worship' and where criticism are levied against him, people go ballistic resulting in the toxic outburst of naked hostility.
I careless what Miguna does with his children, as I am not privy to what takes place in his house. It is gross for people to refer to his children as being treated badly forming a view of an appearance of a few minutes on TV.
Raila youth-wingers must know people take 'rule of law', 'justice' and 'due process' very seriously.
It is hypocritical to call for rule of law, justice and due process for Nancy Baraza but to deny the same to Miguna.
Adongo,
We disagreed before on Miguna.
You are being nasty. Whether Miguna was 'detained' or not is never an issue, and should not be. There is no currency in detention - it was a misfortune which befell some people, just like some people suffer Malaria. If one feels aggrieve, one can seek legal remedy, and many Kenyans have taken that route seeking restitution that way, but I doubt if people should run around with shrewd comments castigating others for not being detained. Does it mean because Miguna was not 'detained', that should act as a licence that he is treated the way he was by Raila? You know that it the treatment that he suffered at the hands of Raila which has caused Miguna to behave the way he has. That is Miguna's reaction has causation straight from the Raila's treatment. Why are very keen to rub salt on his injuries?
Second, whether Miguna wrote speeches for Raila is a statement to be confirmed/denied by Raila himself. No one would know if it is true or not unless one claims to be with Raila 24/7.
Third, you are on record to make fun of the way Miguna types - with one finger. Was that really necessary?
We have to leave Miguna alone to deal with his tormentors in ways he sees fits even if his tormentors in one Raila.
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Post by Onyango Oloo on Jan 7, 2012 22:42:21 GMT 3
Adongo:
I saw your message.
I will just say one thing:
I read every single post in this thread before I posted my comments. I was conveying the collective, general impression that I formed. Obviously not every single posting reflected that general impression.
Onyango Oloo
Nairobi, Kenya
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Post by Onyango Oloo on Jan 7, 2012 22:45:35 GMT 3
OO, By any chance are you trying justify exposure of the kids to further trauma.? The simple answer to your question is: NO.Onyango Oloo
Nairobi, Kenya |
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Post by Onyango Oloo on Jan 7, 2012 22:49:38 GMT 3
OOWith due respect and without insulting your inteligence, you being the moderator, and one who holds the key to jukwaa, sometimes your reactions to other jukwaaist, moreso on matters MIGUNA MIGUNA, are quite intimidating. Well, I am damned if I do, and damned if I don't. When I refrain from commenting on ongoing threads, people complain of my "loud silence." When I chip in with my pesa nane, people like you accuse me of being "intimidating." What do you want me to do? Onyango Oloo
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Post by Onyango Oloo on Jan 7, 2012 23:03:34 GMT 3
I saw Miguna caressing his crotch in that TV interview and I was like 'oh my God; this is bad optics especially in light of a previous rape case against Miguna Miguna in Canada.' MM should be aware that all his words, body language, intentions, and all will be analyzed and psychoanalyzed from now on and should take precautions to control for that. This is because unlike his belligerent stances against personalities in Kenya that he has engaged in in the past, he is now fighting an institution. Raila is an institution unto himself. You never win wars against institutions that easily. I lived in the same province and in the same city with Miguna for close to twenty years. Googling around this is what I found out: This is what I was talking about. Some folks have degenerated to such lows as actually making up stories about Miguna Miguna to score some dubious points. Onyango Oloo
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Post by sunday on Jan 7, 2012 23:34:56 GMT 3
Sadik, For the record I'm the one who brought that one-finger-typing humor. Not Adongo. It was a mere joke nothing serious. I bet most folks here on jukwaa have crazy blood pressures. In this world we live in these days, humor is necessary even in funerals. The more you laugh the longer you live. We need to cool our heads on certain things folks. On the kids, ohhh how lovely, Miguna must have ok'd for them to be aired, after all, he was right there when the damn clip was being shot. I don't see anything wrong with that. It's not like the Citizen crew sneaked at night and shot them without their parent's notice. So Nerea, please calm down on that.
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Post by furaha on Jan 8, 2012 0:22:31 GMT 3
Now look at this article in the Sunday Nation. www.nation.co.ke/News/politics/Miguna+fallout+with+Raila+the+inside+story+/-/1064/1301652/-/item/0/-/e4m9g0z/-/index.htmlI don't want to be party to mud slinging. So let me just correct one section where it states that MM contradicted AG Amos Wako at a review conference of the ICC statute which took place in Kampala. Technically speaking this is correct but it is important to have the full context in which this happened. The Office of the PM was kept out of the meetings to prepare the official Kenyan position for the conference and the instructions for the Kenyan delegation, headed by Amos Wako. As it turned out the official position that was formulated became highly contentious because its minimum objective seems to have been to create an interpretation of the Statute which would help to achieve a deferral of the two Kenyan ICC cases for the period of at least one year. The official position seemed to claim that the States Parties to the Statute should 1. move towards a broader interpretation of complementarity 2. should be made to understand that in Kenya’s case not enough was done by the ICC to ensure that complementarity was achieved while Kenya had made every effort to move forward. When it became clear to ODM that the other side of the government was trying to advance a very one-sided position James Orengo and Miguna Miguna were included in the Kenyan delegation at the very last moment. And yes, the battle between the members of the divided delegation was tough. That's what happens when one side of a coalition government ignores the other in the preparations for a critical meeting... If you do not shout at the top of your lungs, you do not get heard. Some of this is reflected in a post by Phil jukwaa.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=4197And in this article you will find an article about what James Orengo said at the conference. english.alshahid.net/archives/7273And here's another media report on the divided delegation www.voanews.com/english/news/africa/Kenya-and-Sudan-in-the-Spotlight-as-ICC-conference-Opens-in-Uganda-95263209.htmlThe general mud slinging has now degraded to such an extent that even historical and well documented events are quoted out of context in an effort to keep the blows raining down. Let's at least stick to facts and avoid innuendo, hear-say and deliberate distortions. The Nation article is heavy on all three. Furaha |
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Post by kasuku on Jan 8, 2012 0:45:31 GMT 3
Does anyone know anything about this Raila/Timberlake torture issue Miguna has suposedly told the CNN about? MIGUNA TO PUBLISH HOW RAILA & CRONIES TORTURED TIMBERLAKE wazua.co.ke/forum.aspx?g=posts&m=249336 |
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Post by mank on Jan 8, 2012 2:03:06 GMT 3
Does anyone know anything about this Raila/Timberlake torture issue Miguna has suposedly told the CNN about?
MIGUNA TO PUBLISH HOW RAILA & CRONIES TORTURED TIMBERLAKE [a href="http://wazua.co.ke/forum.aspx?g=posts&m=249336"]http://wazua.co.ke/forum.aspx?g=posts&m=249336 [/size][/a][/quote] Is it Miguna himself posting at Wazua, or an impostor? Its interesting! The same story appears here. If there is any truth to the allegations, we need to know about it. In that case Miguna should realize Jukwaa accords his name lots of importance (judging by the attention any threads to do with Miguna stuff attracts), and so if he is posting at Wazua or any other place he should consider posting here too! Of course he is free not to post here, but since he is a member we must wonder why he would avoid posting here, yet here he is assured of readership - so if its him posting at Wazua I would suspect that he is making stuff up, and therefore shy of the challenge he would get here. The man should bring his stories here ... its just the type of stuff that Jukwaa is made for, and he, Miguna Miguna is a Jukwaa Member. Or is he not? |
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Post by furaha on Jan 8, 2012 3:06:08 GMT 3
Does anyone know anything about this Raila/Timberlake torture issue Miguna has suposedly told the CNN about?
MIGUNA TO PUBLISH HOW RAILA & CRONIES TORTURED TIMBERLAKE [a href="http://wazua.co.ke/forum.aspx?g=posts&m=249336"]http://wazua.co.ke/forum.aspx?g=posts&m=249336 [/size][/a][/quote] This is clearly an imposter. Please note that this appeared on CNN iRreport on which anyone can report stories they think merit CNN's attention. It is clearly not a CNN report. and when you go to CNN iReport you will see that it is very easy to report under a fake name. Unfortunately this happens more and more. One's name is no longer one's own! My advice: ignore this report. That is what it deserves. Furaha |
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Post by mwalimumkuu on Jan 8, 2012 4:54:11 GMT 3
OO,
Thanks for your intervention, the debate was beginning to take a very juvenile slant including how many fingers one has and how they use them to type on the keyboard.
I hope people will go back and listen to MM and at least interrogate what he is saying rather than how he is saying it.
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Post by b6k on Jan 8, 2012 5:07:38 GMT 3
2. My second point flows from the same Citizen clip. Eagle eyed Jukwaaists seemed to have been fixated on Miguna's genitals because they were quick to report that he was grabbing his crotch while fielding questions from Evelyn who was sitting across the living room-separated by tables and other pieces of furniture. I did NOT notice the hand on the crotch thing because I was concentrating on Miguna's face and the words which came out of his MOUTH when he answered questions posed to him by Evelyn. Since there seems to be a sexual insinuation being slyly implied here, let me also mischeviously ask those who noticed Miguna apparently grabbing his family jewels: Kwani is there some sensual thing some of you have for Miguna? And to the men who first noticed this, are you revealing some subterranean homoerotic crush buried deep, deep under your Victorian moralizing? I mean, can some of you climb from that gutter you are wallowing in?OO, that's a low blow coming from you as admin & can be taken as an insult against a certain minority which you warn all Jukwaa-ists not to engage in. I know Miguna is your friend but his actions speak for themselves. I happen to own a 32" HDTV flatscreen TV (but do I say!) so the images are a lot larger & it's pretty difficult to miss any action on the screen. As I am not the only one who noticed it, maybe we can just agree that your concentrating only on his mouth points towards a dearth of situational awareness on your part than it does to "subterranean homoerotic" motives on those of us who have the ability to visually scan the entire screen thereby enabling us to view the yobbish behavior. If Miguna routinely engages in crotch grabbing for comfort when he finds himself in a stressful situation or to allow his train of thought to flow more freely, all power to him. Sadly it is a despicable habit for one to fall into as it makes him appear to be more uncouth than he may actually be. Had he picked his nose midsentence I would've called him out on that as well. |
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Post by moesha on Jan 8, 2012 5:28:55 GMT 3
I have been browsing in silent amazement, stunned by the feasting festival by Jukwaa's digital cannibals gorging themselves in an orgy of voracious and ferocious chomping on Miguna; so impatient have they been that they have dispensed with the inconvenience of cooking or roasting Miguna sufficiently before digging their claws and baring their fangs on him; preferring instead, to devour him in real time, when he still medium rare, still alive, still bloodied from all the body blows he has sustained over the last three or four months. In this surreal and macabre scenario, there are no holds barred: all that has been simmering in the innards of many a Jukwaaist is now being vomited in the open. Oh, the stench of the putrid puke and the pungent bile being spewed on this and other threads! Let me slide in sideways to say one or four things. 1. Let me start with the Citizen interview which has generated so much excitement- with some of our posters revealing their penchant for psychobabble and pseudo-Freudian insights into the subversive subconsciousness. Miguna did NOT solicit that interview. I was at his home to personally witness the genesis of that interview. Right after Miguna's press conference, Citizen's Evelyn Wambui politely approached Miguna and after introducing herself, requested for a full length feature. Those familiar with Citizen know about the "Newsmaker" slots where Evelyn or one of her colleagues goes into someone's home and tries to give a backgrounder to a person who is in the public limelight. They have done that with cabinet minister Murugi (who revealed her love for Mexican soaps and Nollywood pot boilers); Red Cross head honcho Gullet; Emma Kosgey's dad; on Friday night Lillian Muli Kanene was talking to Dennis Oliech's mum. Since it is more a human interest story, the cameras would hover into the subject's private and family life to show the human being behind the news headlines. Those of us who have known Miguna for some time know that he is an intensely private person. Even I, who has been Miguna's friend for many years, rarely meet Miguna at his house because he makes a clear separation between his public/political life and his family and domestic milieu. Some of you have noticed that Miguna's wife does NOT appear anywhere in the Citizen clip. Having consented to the laid back "get to know you" format of the "News Maker" format, it would have been ludicrous for Miguna to turn around and insist/demand on a BBC Hard Talk or CNN Cross Fire approach. Personally I did not see anything wrong with Miguna being portrayed as a father of beautiful daughters; I have seen Kibaki portayed as a grandfather, Raila as a family man, same with Ruto and other public personages. Not once have I witnessed the self-righteous hand wringing that I notice in this thread because one of Miguna's daughters was singing and another one revealing to whole wide world that she wants to be a doctor when she grows up. 2. My second point flows from the same Citizen clip. Eagle eyed Jukwaaists seemed to have been fixated on Miguna's genitals because they were quick to report that he was grabbing his crotch while fielding questions from Evelyn who was sitting across the living room-separated by tables and other pieces of furniture. I did NOT notice the hand on the crotch thing because I was concentrating on Miguna's face and the words which came out of his MOUTH when he answered questions posed to him by Evelyn. Since there seems to be a sexual insinuation being slyly implied here, let me also mischeviously ask those who noticed Miguna apparently grabbing his family jewels: Kwani is there some sensual thing some of you have for Miguna? And to the men who first noticed this, are you revealing some subterranean homoerotic crush buried deep, deep under your Victorian moralizing? I mean, can some of you climb from that gutter you are wallowing in?As for the one finger typing.. All of you know Miguna primarily from what he writes. Pass your kudos to that one finger which has not been flashed at you, but rather, employed to churn out hundreds of thousands of incendiary, provocative prose. And some of you went ballistic on the fact that it was a NIGERIAN movie which was showing on the telly. My goodness! Some of you should seriously get a freaking life for crying out loud! For anyone who has ever done this kind of TV interview (and I have done a couple), you know there are things called cut away shots where the camera person will ask you to stroll, and if you are a writer like Miguna, ask you sit in front of your computer and type (yes with one or twenty fingers), pretend you are watching television, drinking tea or eating githeri or omena so that when they finally show the clip it is not just a series of boring talking heads. And some of you have issues with that?! Ngai Fafa! Masira Kindaki!3. The third point is general. The level of incessant personal attacks on Miguna- even from some of Jukwaa's finest minds-is simply mind boggling. Onyango Oloo
Nairobi, KenyaIn all fairness Jukwaa folks have as much right to question criticise, praise redicule and respond in any way they so wish to Miguna's own criticism of others just as Miguna has a right to make those criticisms. Miguna is not a god or a saint beyond reproach and he will be the first one to say that. So lets get away from any thought that anybody questioning Miguna is somehow committing a sin in Jukwaa. I find your statement about issues being raised about Miguna as "petrid puke and pungent bile" quite disturbing in an atmosphere where we have promoted free speech as a conerstone of Jukwaa's core principles. As a matter of fact I find the whole statement below from you unneccessary. "In this surreal and macabre scenario, there are no holds barred: all that has been simmering in the innards of many a Jukwaaist is now being vomited in the open.
Oh, the stench of the putrid puke and the pungent bile being spewed on this and other threads!"As a friend and comrade both to you and to Miguna I feel it is necessary for me to raise those concerns and I am sure you willtake it in the spirit it has been raised. Secondly I think there are issues Miguna has raised that I felt I need to respond to and I have had done so without fear or favour. Let me take one example. Miguna accused Raila among other things of being unable and unprepared to write his own speeches and that it was Miguna who helped him with that. I will state for the record and you can ask Miguna himself to tell you that I am one of those approached by Miguna many times to help write some of those speeches. It was never a big deal. It came within the flow of work we were already doing. Raila as you know is very much a people person. For him mingling and interacting with people, listening to their concerns may have taken priority over fine speeches. That is an important context and Miguna of all people knows that. We all need to be honest in both directions. Raila was never making rounds to make speeches but now and again Miguna being one of the the closest persons to him would feel the need to have a well prepared speech ready for whatever occasion at home and abroad. It was work we did as a very minor part of the rapidly developing scenarios. Different people contributed whatever little they could and it was never to hold Raila hostage with that. If everybody who has participated in working with Raila or any other politician were to go to TV to list their contributions we might need a TV channel dedicated only to that. I was sometimes called by Miguna at 7.00 pm in the evening and the work had to be finished by midnight same night. It was pressure pact. These were really non issues and none of us even had the slightest idea that some day we will be boasting on TV about such to try to embarrass the person we were presumably helping. These things are done by many silent anonymous folks out there and I find it in bad taste for Miguna to use work which was not even done by him alone as a tool to bludgeon the PM just because they are having serious disagreements on which someone like me has supported Miguna when I felt it was the right thing. What is wrong with adongo ogony raising such concerns? When does that become "petrid puke"? On the issue of the kids I for one would trust Miguna's judgment as a father. He is a damn good father for those of us who have had the pleasure to know him and some of his kids. I am fond of talking about the 15 year old young gun, Karimi Adongo, simply because I really like the guy and we do al ot of things together including monumental wrestling matches where I am usually on the losing end of things. I trust that people would leave it to me to decide the limits to which I can expose him to my friends. Very soo I wil llose all such rights when he turns 18. My first born is now a grown adult living his own life. I think the one finger assault on the computer key board is just genuinely funny. I rpobably do the same except I have never seen it on TV. People are going to make fun of such things. It is OK to just laugh them off and have fun with them. You have seen Saturday Night Live comic stuff. They make fun of everybody. So yeah, while some people have their own agenda with Miguna and may cross the line now and again in their zeal to bludgeon Miguna, I think it is unfair todismiss and tarnish all criticism and commentaries about the Miguna story with the words you have used. Let's have a fair debate. Just as Miguna did not invite Citizen TV to his house but accepted their self invite, so did we not ask Miguna to go to Citizen TV. Once he goes there and says xyz, we should be allowed to comment on what he says without being made to feel like we are assaulting Miguna. It is fair game both ways. That is all I have to say and I do so knowing you are one of the few people I know who takes criticism very seriously. Otherwise I find your perpective from the vintage point of being on the ground and close to Miguna and to the media quite refreshing and helpful in grasping the whole picture. Really good points you raise there. I think its is within every members democratic right to voice their opinions on this matter of Miguna Miguna, who himself has not shied away or held back. I am yet to hear the other side's story. Oloo claims moral uprightness, but at the same time doesn't hesitate to take a swipe at other people at voicing their thoughts. Its fine if he see's nothing wrong with MM's antics, but can we agree to disagree. I was among the people who raised the issue concerning the children. While all those other politicians may have exposed their families to the media at some point, context and timing are key. There is so much heat/negativity surrounding MM, he is on TV defending himself against wrongs that he claims have been lodged against him. He also claimed that there were threats made against his life just last month. Surely if for a minute those threats were anything to go by, would any sensible person be exposing their families in the media for the whole world to see at this particular time? I did not and still don't think this was a good time for that kind of exposure on the beautiful little girls. I am also a parent so I know a thing or two about raising kids. ni hiyo tu. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2012 8:43:07 GMT 3
I saw Miguna caressing his crotch in that TV interview and I was like 'oh my God; this is bad optics especially in light of a previous rape case against Miguna Miguna in Canada.' MM should be aware that all his words, body language, intentions, and all will be analyzed and psychoanalyzed from now on and should take precautions to control for that. This is because unlike his belligerent stances against personalities in Kenya that he has engaged in in the past, he is now fighting an institution. Raila is an institution unto himself. You never win wars against institutions that easily. I lived in the same province and in the same city with Miguna for close to twenty years. Googling around this is what I found out: This is what I was talking about. Some folks have degenerated to such lows as actually making up stories about Miguna Miguna to score some dubious points. Onyango Oloo
Nairobi, KenyaYou're kidding me! You do not want to go there! I live in that same city where Miguna and you lived. People here on JUKWAA have brought up this case from time to time. I remained silent because I knew that most of them did not care about crimes committed against women but were out to get Miguna for other reasons. But if you Oloo want to go there, then lets duke it out on this one. Just because a person is acquitted of charges does not mean they are innocent in case you didn't know that already. Do you remember what Miguna said publicly when Njeri Ngugi that is Ngugi wa Thiong'o's partner was raped in Nairobi? Do you remember too what Miguna said to Michere Mugo's daughter right in front of me at an event that we had organized at St. Christopher House right at Ossington and Dundas? If you and Miguna don't remember I for one do. I have responded to you here publicly because you've put this out here in this public forum comrade. |
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Post by Onyango Oloo on Jan 8, 2012 8:47:09 GMT 3
OO, that's a low blow coming from you as admin & can be taken as an insult against a certain minority which you warn all Jukwaa-ists not to engage in. I know Miguna is your friend but his actions speak for themselves. I happen to own a 32" HDTV flatscreen TV (but do I say!) so the images are a lot larger & it's pretty difficult to miss any action on the screen. As I am not the only one who noticed it, maybe we can just agree that your concentrating only on his mouth points towards a dearth of situational awareness on your part than it does to "subterranean homoerotic" motives on those of us who have the ability to visually scan the entire screen thereby enabling us to view the yobbish behavior. If Miguna routinely engages in crotch grabbing for comfort when he finds himself in a stressful situation or to allow his train of thought to flow more freely, all power to him. Sadly it is a despicable habit for one to fall into as it makes him appear to be more uncouth than he may actually be. Had he picked his nose midsentence I would've called him out on that as well. There is no low blow. The only thing which is low, is anatomically how low some viewers of that Citizen clip descended. Remember the late Wangari Maathai's famous quip urging former President Moi to concentrate ABOVE the belt rather than below it? Get the context of my observation from the same passage you quoted: You see, once you open the Pandora's Box of analyzing apparent subliminal sexual telegraphs, then you too must withstand scrutiny. It is a case of the Watcher being watched.
Let me illustrate with an example from way back in late 1988 that Adongo Ogony here in Jukwaa can attest to because he was there. On November 17th 1988, Adongo Ogony, the late Githirwa wa Muhoro and I, Onyango Oloo, boarded a KLM flight from Kilimanjaro International Airport in Dar es Salaam, Tanzania. We flew to the Netherlands, landing at Schiphol International Airport in Amsterdam where we cooled our heels for over eight hours waiting for our connecting flight to Pearson International Airport in Toronto, Canada. We arrived in the financial capital of the Land of the Maple Leaf to be met by a gruff, somewhat bigoted Immigration Canada official who had come to receive the trio of us who had disembarked on North American soil (or is it asphalt) as Landed Immigrants (in other words Permanent Residents) because of our status as political exiles recognized by Canadian federal laws as "government assisted refugees". We were quickly shipped off to a run down, derelict hostel located at Dundas and Jarvis in downtown Toronto where we stayed for about three weeks before we all moved to a "rooming house" just south of the Pape subway station in the east end of the city. For those who do not know, a "rooming house" is essentially an apartment building, townhouse, maisonette etc where the landlord or landlady is renting out the individual rooms to individual tenants with the kitchen and living room being common areas accessed by all. Each of us- Adongo, Githirwa and I got our separate rooms in the basement of the building. This is a common experience for new arrivals-immigrants, refugees and refugee claimants(there is a legal distinction among the three categories)-in Canada and indeed other Western countries. At the time of our arrival there were already other Kenyan political exiles who were in Canada courtesy of the same federal immigration policy. There were people like Peter Gakiri, Omondi Obanda, James Anampiu, Miguna Miguna, Nderi Munoru, Kamotho, Jimnah Mwangi Kigondu, the late Mathenge, Waweru, Wainaina and James Karanja who were already in the country. Obanda, Mwangi, Gakiri and Miguna were residing in Toronto (with Obanda and Miguna living near the Victoria Park subway station; Jimnah "Mapinduzi" Mwangi just below the 501 King Street Car line at 21 Temple Street on Dufferin and King; one person was even living in his car but I wont mention names for obvious reasons). Anampiu and Munoru were domiciled in Vancouver while Kamotho was in the industrial city of Hamilton a couple of hours from Toronto and James Karanja Ng'ang'a living in London (Ontario, not England) about three hours away. Just before Xmas that year, James Karanja decided to visit the three of us- Githirwa, Adongo and I who like mentioned earlier, were marooned in that dingy rooming house owned by a sixty something Indo-Trinidadian woman who was a Canadian citizen but run by a caretaker who happened to be her own forty something bachelor son working as a civil servant for the Canadian government. Karanja arrived late on what I remember was a Friday evening that winter (our first). We chatted and chatted and chatted for there was a lot of catching up to do since Karanja had left us in Dar es Salaam (he was hosted by a law professor at the university called Tenga while I lived with my cousin married to a Tanzanian engineer in Mikoroshini near Msasani while Adongo, Githirwa, Mwangi, Osare Nakinson, Obanda, the late Kaara wa Macharia and other Kenyan refugees lived in a working class complex at Mwananyamala). It was not until after one o'clock in the morning when it hit us that we had to find a place for Karanja to sleep. Since we had been yapping in my room, we decided that Karanja would sleep in the extra bed in my room. So we slept. As Kenyans there was nothing strange or unusual because we were all used to those makeshift arrangements back home. It was not until we were having breakfast in the common kitchen area that we found out a shocking thing: our Ethiopian rooming house mates whispered to us that our bachelor caretaker was passing inuendoes around the building that Karanja and I were HOMOSEXUAL LOVERS because we slept in the same room! We were not only mystified; we were mighty miffed and palpably pissed! We wanted Nairobi style mass action there and then! Adongo, do you remember this? How could they even imagine such a ridiculous scenario? It was then that one of quiet Ethiopians calmed us down with this revelation: "You Kenyans calm down. As an Ethiopian, as an African I see nothing wrong. But you see this is Canada. Two men sharing a room will raise eyebrows. Besides our caretaker is 45 years old has never married and sleeps in the SAME BED WITH HIS MOTHER!"Onyango Oloo
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Post by morimax on Jan 8, 2012 9:14:23 GMT 3
Read more: jukwaa.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=6325&page=9#ixzz1iqNG5nqkOO,I was once taught that given a chance to examine an individual during an interview or whenever, the examiner needs to assess the individual wholistically, from head to toe, vocal language and body language, in order to come up with a new correct impression about the person. It has nothing to do with " revealing some subterranean homoerotic crush buried deep, deep under your Victorian moralizing" as you put it. You realize that the contributors on this matter have assessed MM on all aspects, but unfortunately you have missed the other points due to narrowed focus. Yes, it is known that issues like, formed opnion about a subject, prejudice, minimised attention, may always impede proper judgement. Fortunately, you were just being mischeviuos. |
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Post by samson on Jan 8, 2012 10:54:08 GMT 3
Being a pm advisor is not a birth right, in kenya- people are very bitter when removed from public service because they are not true servants, they serve themselves. MM shd just leave queitly he can serve kenyans in a different capacity
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Post by b6k on Jan 8, 2012 13:12:39 GMT 3
OO what a delightful tale. I was wondering where you were going with that but I must admit you had me in stitches at the end.
Your loyalty to Miguna is commendable but as I stated on another thread, given the extremes Miguna has gone to, it's misplaced. You now even have Kathure breathing down your neck ready to "toboa" all about a rather controversial incident involving Miguna in Canada. Let me say it again, sometimes the best thing you can do for a friend is advise him when he's erred. Staying in his corner even as he continues to step from one landmine to the next is actually prolonging his agony.
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Post by adongo23456 on Jan 8, 2012 14:03:01 GMT 3
oloo,
That was funny. It reminded me of that long winded journey. By the way the always rude care taker ended up being literally roughed up by the old man Mr. Mathenge from London Ontario when one day he found us having dinner in the kitchen and yanked a chair off Mathenge's butt claiming that was his chair and nobody including our visitors from out of town was allowed to sit on it.
It was a very strange thing for us and in the commotion we threw the chair out through the window. It was very obvious we had to get a new place to live and we did so in short order. Oh my.
But I get your point which is that harsh and narrow judgments on people are more often than not often based on ignorance about situations people do not understand.
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Post by Omwenga on Jan 8, 2012 15:41:08 GMT 3
It was not until we were having breakfast in the common kitchen area that we found out a shocking thing: our Ethiopian rooming house mates whispered to us that our bachelor caretaker was passing inuendoes around the building that Karanja and I were HOMOSEXUAL LOVERS because we slept in the same room! We were not only mystified; we were mighty miffed and palpably pissed! We wanted Nairobi style mass action there and then! Adongo, do you remember this? How could they even imagine such a ridiculous scenario? It was then that one of quiet Ethiopians calmed us down with this revelation: "You Kenyans calm down. As an Ethiopian, as an African I see nothing wrong. But you see this is Canada. Two men sharing a room will raise eyebrows. Besides our caretaker is 45 years old has never married and sleeps in the SAME BED WITH HIS MOTHER!"Onyango Oloo
Nairobi, KenyaOO, A funny tale indeed. Reminds me of a similar if not somewhat more serious involving a handful of Kenyans in Texas back in the day (mid 80s). Please allow me to musingly share. In those days Kenyans hardly went out to clubs as they mostly preferred to have house parties (or more appropriately, apartment parties as nobody then owned a house). On one such occasion, we are partying at one of our friends apartment and as it would often be the case working sometimes two jobs while going to college, several decided to lump themselves in one bed as it was getting into the wee hours so they can catch some sleep before going to work or school but could not go to their homes as nobody was interested in stopping watering to give them a ride. As it were, the party got a little too noisy for the neighbor who called the police. The police arrived and surely enough found the several men in one bed completely covered under one blanket! You see, Texas is one state to this day with strict sodomy laws so the police were ready to haul the hapless but straight Kenyans to jail we had to really convince them there was no monkey business going on with any of them. Fortunately, they believed us and spared them a trip to the cells and the whole thing became a joke told and retold many times ever since. My personal experience has to do with how I found out homosexuals exist--something I had never heard of in my nearly 20 years of living before leaving Kenya for studies in the US. Before leaving Kenya, I had neatly packed in my tiny suitcase (there was not a single suit in it) anyway I packed this brand new pink corduroy jeans and while wearing them one day with my obligatory Blondie date, she broke the news to me the color pink is a preferred color for homos! It was then that I found out about the existence of homos and what a shocker it was. I know I never saw men the same way from then on and could only but imagine all those things I used to see back home men holding hands and even dancing together during oboko (traditional weddings)--were they? Nah, I don't think so; not in a million years. That would change and has changed. You see a man holding another one's hand, or dancing with another one these days, they are!!!! Gone are the days of innocence in so many respects. |
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Post by adongo23456 on Jan 8, 2012 15:56:58 GMT 3
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Post by Onyango Oloo on Jan 8, 2012 17:33:13 GMT 3
Does anyone know anything about this Raila/Timberlake torture issue Miguna has suposedly told the CNN about? MIGUNA TO PUBLISH HOW RAILA & CRONIES TORTURED TIMBERLAKE wazua.co.ke/forum.aspx?g=posts&m=249336As Furaha pointed out earlier, this is an OBVIOUS forgery. I can attest to the fact that the ONLY forum Miguna posts to (either directly or through myself, and occasionally through Adongo) is JUKWAA. I spoke to him just now and he was not even aware of wazua.co.ke, leave alone being someone who participates on that site. Onyango Oloo
Nairobi, Kenya |
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Post by Onyango Oloo on Jan 8, 2012 17:53:38 GMT 3
Omwenga:
Thanks for sharing.
The things that Kenyans go through when they first arrive in foreign lands are often hilarious.
Maybe a future book project that Kenyans who have lived outside Kenya can collaborate on is:
Tales from the Kenyan Diaspora: An Anthology.
I just wanted to say that NOTHING in my anecdote should be construed as a put down on members of the gay community.
I KNOW (don't ask me how) that there are SEVERAL members of Jukwaa who ARE gay, lesbian, bisexual etc.
We value their presence and contributions to the discussions on this platform.
Now you will have to KILL ME FIRST before I out any of them.
Onyango Oloo
Nairobi, Kenya
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